Can Anyone Translate? System Quotes

[Guest michelle]

Hi there,

I work in a small business that has suffered three break-ins in 6 months. Time for an alarm system!

We have had 4 firms to quote. These are the best 2 of them, I think, but the subtle differences escape me e.g. does it matter which PIR you use, are more (8) automatically better than 5, are vibration alarms superior etc etc

On the welcome page of this site we are invitied to request opinions of quotes, so here goes, best 2 of 4, I think; I would really welcome any feedback or comments on what it all means and if one looks superior. Both firms seemed good.

Many thanks, Michelle

First quote;

Audio Visual Intruder Alarm in accordance with PD6662:2004, grade 2 bells only. Unsetting method PACE G-tag only. Police called on confirmed alarm (2 detectors activated).

3x CQR FC505 flush contact on doors

8x Rokonet RK800Q iWise Quad PIR

Gardtec 872 Control Panel grade 3 env class2

2x ardtec G-Tec contour LCD Keypad

6x key fobs

2x gardiner extension speakers

Gardtec Nova active external bell grade 3 env class 4, plus dummy bell

Gardtec 840/816/800 modem

[Guest]

There is no way we can tell really we havnt seen your site, know what you carry, how to gain entry etc etc.

More sensors are usually better but it depends on the type of sensors. Obvioulsy you can buy 16 cheap pirs for the price of an expensive dualtec, and quads may not be the best sensor for your environment.

It is very difficult to call, and its nice to see you looking for best overall, rather than cheapest. ALso what are the vibrations sensors going on, i dont like using them as they can alarm during a genuine but because there is no signs of a break in everyone would believe it to be false. That is just my personaly opnion.

You say you have had 4 quotes, did you give them all the same info?

Youalso say its time for an alarm, did you decide this or did your insurance have a hand.

What grade have they all decided on? and what signalling is used (redcared gsm, dualcom etc)

James

Michelle

Have you considered a security smoke system to compliment the alarm? You are obviously a good target based on the amount of attacks you have had.

The principal is when the alarm goes off and is confirmed a Smoke Generator fills the whole room with harmless dense white smoke so the intruder can't see to steal anything. For more info and to see videos visit www.smoke-screen.co.uk. Matt from Smoke Screen is part of our forum. He goes by the really imaginitive name of well ummm "Smoke Screen"!

As for the alarm, I am with James on the Vibration Sensors.

Putting a post like this in a forum like this will get mixed replies. Personally I dislike the control panel and the Rokonet sensors, but other installers will love them.

Look around your neighbours and see who looks after there security. Knock on the door and ask the question if the system is reliable and if they are happy with service.

Good luck.

Dave

[Guest]

I work in a small business that has suffered three break-ins in 6 months. Time for an alarm system!

Alarm in before you put anything of value in a building, check your to see if your insurance have requirements eg Redcare, but the fact you don't have an alarm leads me to believe you don't have any insurance??

[Guest rjbsec]

First quote;

Audio Visual Intruder Alarm in accordance with PD6662:2004, grade 2 bells only. Unsetting method PACE G-tag only. Police called on confirmed alarm (2 detectors activated).

On the basis of the information you have posted, I would say that your insurers are unlikely to be happy with a Grade 2 bells only alarm system and you shouldn't be either after 3 burglaries - you should contact your insurers for advice BEFORE you make any decision.

[Woosh]

If its bells only why is there a modem on the list and talk of police response ???

[mjw]

First quote says bells only, then goes on to say Police called on confirmed? slight contradiction there somewhere.

Did any of these people actually provide you with a proposal of where they are installing the components as well as what they are installing?

Cant really comment on the equipment quoted, without seeing the property its hard to tell whats best suited, (Its not about whether one product is better than another, its what would detect intruders at your property best) none of it looks that bad. If any of your neighboors are using these companies, ask them what they think of the service recieved, this should help with the end decision.

Pete

Why go for a PACE unset method if you are not going to have police response

[Guest michelle]

Thanks to everyone who replied - I appreciate the time to consider the problem and comment.

Yes, we are fully insured, and the insurance company has not responded by imposing any conditions, although neither has it stumped up any money yet, depite putting in the first claim in July. Our brokers suggested it wouldn't make any difference approaching the insurance company about alarm sytems, and that it certainly wouldn't lower our premiums to install one - but it would be heart breaking to find out that the insurance company then insited on a higher spec. system, or something similar. However, I'm also cautious about the insurance company suggesting something that may break our bank if we ask directly!

I asked all companies to quote for a monitored response - the first company now say bells only was a mis-print. Both companies took time to consider layout quite throughly (we are a long thin 2-story building), and, from what I can glean from their written quotes, are thinking along the same lines (diagrams - which they drew at the time, would help here, chaps!). From the posts it seems the first quote may be slightly superior, although you mention reservations about the PIR type? why is that

The kind of work we do rules out smoke alarms. I think we are being targeted purely because they can - using old wooden windows as weak points; initially they targeted a quiet side passage. This was rapidly appointed with 2 intruder lights and spikes, and all the windows were placed with PVC - iron bars about to be fitted throughout the grounfloor windows. We hoped that might be sufficient, especially as anything of value is now bolted, vaulted and post-coded and they only got petty cash (

[Guest michelle]

There is no way we can tell really we havnt seen your site, know what you carry, how to gain entry etc etc.

More sensors are usually better but it depends on the type of sensors. Obvioulsy you can buy 16 cheap pirs for the price of an expensive dualtec, and quads may not be the best sensor for your environment.

erm....would an optex be better than a quad? We have a long thin building with entrance fore and aft, and a first floor with one window looking out over a single story roof. Windows will all be PVC by the end of the month and downstairs will all be barred. Rooms are quite small, and lead through from one to another.

It is very difficult to call, and its nice to see you looking for best overall, rather than cheapest. ALso what are the vibrations sensors going on, i dont like using them as they can alarm during a genuine but because there is no signs of a break in everyone would believe it to be false. That is just my personaly opnion.

erm........around windows, I think, in case of being smashed.

You say you have had 4 quotes, did you give them all the same info?

Youalso say its time for an alarm, did you decide this or did your insurance have a hand.

What grade have they all decided on? and what signalling is used (redcared gsm, dualcom etc)

yes, all firms had the same info. All seem to have come back with grade 2 - have no idea what this means - it's just written there in the quote. Signalling? erm............... not redcare, bcause of the cost. Not heard of dualcom. I think we are just using phonelines as they stand. Should I be asking more questions. I think the theives are oportunists - see the last post - so hopefully will not be cutting phone lines.

James

Thanks for replying

Michelle

[Guest michelle]

have you considered cctv systems??

colin

cjt electrical

Gosh yes, ,cos I'd so like to catch the b*****s in the act, but being start up we are trying to watch costs, and I guess the alarm system is the priority. Hopefully once we've got that we won't need CCTV. We've only had problems in the dead of night - I've been working late when some of the break-ins have occured, so we know they occur between midnight and 7 o'clock.

I guess you can it the other way i.e. that CCTV would put them off, but i'm not sure that it is as much as a deterrent as a ringing alarm bell.

Thanks for asking,

Michelle

[Guest]

Gosh yes, ,cos I'd so like to catch the b*****s in the act, but being start up we are trying to watch costs, and I guess the alarm system is the priority. Hopefully once we've got that we won't need CCTV. We've only had problems in the dead of night - I've been working late when some of the break-ins have occured, so we know they occur between midnight and 7 o'clock.

I guess you can it the other way i.e. that CCTV would put them off, but i'm not sure that it is as much as a deterrent as a ringing alarm bell.

Thanks for asking,

Michelle

CCTV would be a waste of money IMO. The only possible way CCTV would be an advantage is if it's monitored or somebody is looking at the picture.

The only possitive for CCTV in this instance is you could see them robbing you and MAY get an ID but this in unlikely. The negative is they may even steal the CCTV system!

Dave