Cctv Specifications: An Interesting Reading

[arfur mo]

I sincerely hope that arfur doesn't blow a gasket, but I have to agree with the points that he made " The security industry is capable of providing good CCTV surveillance using current existing technologies to provide clear, high quality pictures throughout. This regretfully is not the state of affairs and the security industry should only blame itself for the unacceptable quality of CCTV pictures and recordings we see, which are very often a direct result of the published hype and plain wrong CCTV specifications. This path taken by the security and CCTV industry, was and is, self-destructive and it must be changed "

To be fair, I don't think the CCTV Industry can really be held solely to blame, and rather than looking back at what has previously been done badly, I am actively looking forward, to see what can be done to try and address the current situation.

Incidentally, apologies to The Tech Guy ... thank you so much for your very kind words, and I'm sorry I didn't spot your post sooner

hi Doktar Jon, a good post, and with some informed and decent insight at least.

while i appluad you drive towards better i don't think you can blame the pro installers, as to the kit being used. until some way of stemming the tide of the very cheap and often shody usually asian originated (fact is not racism but tuth) equipment we can not move forward.

the client most of the time looks at the

[james.wilson]

arfur i doubt any of us will disagree here. I loose cctv schemes as i wont compromise on equipement. The cheapest cam we use is a bosch cam, cheapest dvr a DM unit etc etc. Cant/wont/dont want to compete with the rubbish that some people install. But your right the customer thinks

a camera is a camera

a dvr is a dvr

an ir lamp is an ir lamp

you get the idea. Some get this others dont. But it isnt purly kit choice

[Doktor Jon]

while i appluad you drive towards better i don't think you can blame the pro installers, as to the kit being used. until some way of stemming the tide of the very cheap and often shody usually asian originated (fact is not racism but tuth) equipment we can not move forward.

the client most of the time looks at the

[arfur mo]

hi D.J.

i do admire your entering the lions den to answer with your views.

what angered me so much was the article has now been published and onesidedly downed the pro trade with imo poor thought to actual construction. it can be used to 'beat' the true tradesmen pro's over the head by the nondescrpt's undoing any good intent which left such a sour taste.

it would have been far better to consult estabished CCTv installing companies, then their views i expressed about pricing, could have been presented.

but i have removed the 'pin's from the doll' now and stopped the ravid chanting at midnight (i'm a losy singer anyway so the neighbours are now happier).

regs

alan

[Doktor Jon]

hi D.J.

i do admire your entering the lions den to answer with your views.

what angered me so much was the article has now been published and onesidedly downed the pro trade with imo poor thought to actual construction. it can be used to 'beat' the true tradesmen pro's over the head by the nondescrpt's undoing any good intent which left such a sour taste.

it would have been far better to consult estabished CCTv installing companies, then their views i expressed about pricing, could have been presented.

but i have removed the 'pin's from the doll' now and stopped the ravid chanting at midnight (i'm a losy singer anyway so the neighbours are now happier).

regs

alan

arfur,

You've probably seen and read as many articles as I have, and we both know that most authors tend to write from a singular viewpoint, often because they haven't had the opportunity of seeing a subject from any other direction. The articles author is entitled to his opinion, as indeed are we, so there's no pressure on us to necessarily agree with everything that's written.

I don't actually think I've ventured into a lions den, so much as had the opportunity to communicate with a bunch of guys who all have a wide range of knowledge and experience. That after all is what helps to make the world go round.

Careful where you put those pins now, and try not to do any excessive chanting when there's a full moon ... that's my department

for now,

Jon

[arfur mo]

arfur,

You've probably seen and read as many articles as I have, and we both know that most authors tend to write from a singular viewpoint, often because they haven't had the opportunity of seeing a subject from any other direction. The articles author is entitled to his opinion, as indeed are we, so there's no pressure on us to necessarily agree with everything that's written.

for now,

Jon

hi Jon,

i'm the first to defend a persons right to a personal viewpoint or opinion no matter how much i may disagree, and i do very often, as long as it is fair and accurate when it escapes the skull and gets into print.

i don't accept generalisations when stated as facts in such a forceful and derogatory way towards the profesionals, as that article did without putting anyof other the other side of the coin or any qualification showing he even bothered to look or ask.

you say he did not have access to balance his view's then that is a massive condemnation of him in my book, has as much 'juice' as if he wrote that article after watch 10 episodes of ' the worlds most amazing Police video's. his opinion is fine, but he is no jo soap, he has letters behind his name so the public will lend respect to his published and flawed ill informed opinion, and that he has no rights to do ay all.

so i will go on to suggest imho it was written mainly to 'sell copy' and more a result of a wish for recognition as an 'expert' from a higher and very sanctimoneus ground.

this is not aimed at being a direct insult but i'm simply not known to mince my words when 'spiked'.

The security industry is capable of providing good CCTV

surveillance using current existing technologies to provide

clear, high quality pictures throughout.

This regretfully is

not the state of affairs

thats reasonably fair comment

and the security industry should only

blame itself for the unacceptable quality of CCTV pictures

and recordings we see,

thats blatently not fair, and the sanctimoneous bit is underlined - and what realy got 'the king' on his

which are very often a direct result

of the published hype and plain wrong CCTV specifications.

everything is down to accuracy, undestanding and budget so very debateable, and not claiming total inocence here of the pro trade. but we have situations where a camra is to view a side alley just to watch if the waste bin is full, then later a vcr is fitted just in case a burgaly happens @we got a camera so why not' but it was not required to record even refussed the option, but will the client pay for a hi res camera to watch the waste bin area and just incase when the original supplied against requirement'shows a fair picture' - need i answer that for you?

This path taken by the security and CCTV industry, was and

is, self-destructive and it must be changed.

sanctimoeous again and blatently not fair (i'm only allowed 5 emocations)

Security today is about protecting life. It is as important

as the environment, traffic, health, housing, food and other

regulated industries.

this statement is really attrocious and beyond the pale imo, given the earlier 'sins' of the author, it just nakedly seeks to gain a platform of respect brought about by 'his righteous concern' in order to lend credence and so justify the condemnation.

The security industry is not regulated

and the major players, the consultants and the dealers

crowding the security market are proving wrong the theory

that market forces will correct abuses. The security market

is driven by distorted and

[Doktor Jon]

Hi arfur,

Sorry I haven't been able to get back to you on this for a few days.

I've just very quickly (more out of curiosity than anything else) had another quick look at the article.

Now apart from all the terribly clever stuff that to be honest just left me cold, it does appear that even with the benefit of the wondrous product that the author is trying to promote, it still won't do anything in terms of assisting an installer or end user to locate the correct position ( and lens ) for an optimised camera installation.

That is unfortunately down to knowledge and experience, which is not something that can be readily packaged for the masses.

I think you've made your point extremely well, and maybe it would be a tad on the cruel side to invite the author within range, unless of course you were feeling particularly charitable that day.

How about contacting the publisher and seeing if he's interested in an 'alternative' view on the article? Then again, it was published in Australia so perhaps they just do things somewhat differently to us ( rumour has it they mount their cameras upside down ).

Maybe we should just agree that if we were writing it, we certainly would have done things differently

Jon

[Guest]

arfur i doubt any of us will disagree here. I loose cctv schemes as i wont compromise on equipement. The cheapest cam we use is a bosch cam, cheapest dvr a DM unit etc etc. Cant/wont/dont want to compete with the rubbish that some people install. But your right the customer thinks

a camera is a camera

a dvr is a dvr

an ir lamp is an ir lamp

you get the idea. Some get this others dont. But it isnt purly kit choice

i agree with your idea of not selling the **** but would like to address the fact that bosch cameras are made in china by a company that has its HQ in Hong Kong.. DM being expensive doesn't make it necessarily better than comparable asian ones.

it wouldn't solve any problem selling a sony camera if the picture quality is bad.

i have unbranded korean cameas that beat the branded ones anytime and are much cheaper to obtain.

but as said we have to deliver that kind of kit to the customers that we don't have to be shamed of it - rather proud as i see james goal is too.

[arfur mo]

hi jon,

That is unfortunately down to knowledge and experience, which is not something that can be readily packaged for the masses.

and why the distinction should be made very clear between the professional tradesmen and the diy/ amateur trade, not just lump it all together in order to sell his 'authority'.

I think you've made your point extremely well, and maybe it would be a tad on the cruel side to invite the author within range, unless of course you were feeling particularly charitable that day.

i'm always very chartable, please excuse that scratching noise in the background as it's just me sharpening my claws

How about contacting the publisher and seeing if he's interested in an 'alternative' view on the article? Then again, it was published in Australia so perhaps they just do things somewhat differently to us ( rumor has it they mount their cameras upside down ).

given the 'width of angle' and illuminating quality of his article, possibly the author sticks them up kangaroo's apex's. if he cared to do any real research, he might have used 'google' and typed 'cctv forums', he could have tested his theory before publishing..

Maybe we should just agree that if we were writing it, we certainly would have done things differently

Jon

definitely jon, with with some valid research allowing properly constructed and informed remarks. contacting the publisher i think will be a wast of time, they won't sell many copies on counter claims content, so i have email Elbex and invited the author to defend himself with a link to this thread - so lets see what happens.

regs

alan

[Rich]

I agree with most of whats been said.

The cost and brand are not what a CCTV system should be made up of. Cost isn't just the quality of the equipment, you are paying for the parts used, the support provided etc.

Anyway, nowadays you can use the cheapest cameras you could find and just stick the on the wall and walk away, everyone knows if the footage is required by the police for evidence, that the forensic department can make any image crystal clear and zoom into the image with their forensic spec PC's

I believe its called the CSI effect