randelld Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 Hello all. Firstly, I am not a security installer by trade. I sell solar power generation equipment in Spain. Nearly all of our clients are based in remote properties in the countryside. Conventional intruder alarm systems are not worth having in these areas and we have been trying to devise a system that may function better for these people. I heard about a device that got banned in UK some years ago that was a very loud internal sounder that dis-orientated the intruder, even possibly causing him/her pain and discomfort. Does anybody know where I could find these sounders?? Also I have found a company that manufactures smoke devices thatfill the room with smoke, after enquiring I have found out that these systems are very expensive to buy and they have a lot of stipulations on who they allow to buy and install them. The ideal system we would like to put together is as follows Very loud internal sounder, high frequency High wattage strobe Smoke device. Any advice will be greatly received. Thank you
Joe Harris Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 Not sure how things ended up regards the legality of these units as I will explain later. I seem to recall reading an age ago about one called 'Inferno' (Is this the one? www.klaxonsignals.com/safet-security-pages/p_series_inferno.htm) There was also a lot of blurb on another site which again clarified some of the workings but gave no company names details below: Local audible burglar alarms are designed to rush and disorient intruders and attract the attention of witnesses. Especially in urban areas, however, car and other types of alarms are so commonplace that they have become white noise, ignored by passersby. Moreover, the savvy criminal continues his task, unruffled, having calculated how long police response will take. Now, one Swedish firm has figured out that if you can't speed up the police, you can ratchet up the alarm. Last year, the firm introduced an alarm that, it claims, makes a noise so horrible that the burglar will be desperate to flee within seconds. The secret: a series of four different low-frequency sounds that grate against each other and "cause distress to the individual," says David Midgely, business development manager for a firm in England that is selling the product. Because it is a "directional" alarm, it can be targeted to specific areas without affecting others. Midgely says, for example, that someone standing behind the annunciator isn't affected by the sound. The unit's cacophonic 125 decibels, says Midgely, cause a spectrum of reactions, from disorientation to dizziness to physical illness. And because the manufacturer determined that some people can get used to a given sound and tolerate it, the alarm's frequency changes every 15 seconds. Moreover, the manufacturer claims that, due to its low frequency, the alarm doesn't need to be "heard" to work--the effect comes from the vibration--so it transcends earplugs and deafness. Designed for retail businesses, sensitive office areas such as computer rooms, and private homes, the alarm has already generated substantial interest in the United Kingdom since it became available there in April. British police plan to assess it for crowd control as well. (As of this writing it was not available yet in the United States, but U.S. businesses have inquired about the product.) One draw, according to the manufacturer, is that the device attaches to any existing alarm system. Midgely says that testing has shown that the alarm doesn't cause hearing damage in the typical situation, because most people are only exposed to the sound for five or six seconds before they flee the scene. (Writer's note: I was subjected to a five-second blast of the alarm in a long-distance telephone call, where it was explained the impact would not be as intense. Still, within two seconds the alarm made me nervous and jittery.) Also, Midgely says that the disorienting effect doesn't transmit through solid objects such as walls, so while neighbors might hear the alarm they are unlikely to be more than annoyed by it. Also, he says, the alarm automatically stops after three minutes, unless someone cuts the power source, after which a battery backup will then keep the alarm blaring for 20 minutes. Legal experts eye potential liability arising if, say, a disoriented intruder fell and injured himself or was unable to escape the alarm's torturous grip, causing physical injury. Creating a mantrap--trapping someone in a room with the alarm activated--could be problematic. But Midgely stresses that the point of the alarm is to get criminals out, not keep them in. "It won't stop anybody," Midgely says. "But it will severely restrict the time they will want to spend with it." Would be interesting to try it out. Reason I mentioned the legality is that some of these units which have been used for crowd control (Example: around shops in urban areas with youths gathering regularly) were tweaked to use age specific frequency ranges. Over 18s dont hear specific range of audio etc. However well this worked (From reports it appeas very very well) they had to remove the system in the end due to some of the 15 yr old *estate faces* as we call the local young lads n lasses, complaining to the local council that their babies (which they were walking around with outside at 2 am) were getting distressed by the sound. Political correctness always wins over common sense. 'J
randelld Posted January 17, 2007 Author Posted January 17, 2007 However well this worked (From reports it appeas very very well) they had to remove the system in the end due to some of the 15 yr old *estate faces* as we call the local young lads n lasses, complaining to the local council that their babies (which they were walking around with outside at 2 am) were getting distressed by the sound.Political correctness always wins over common sense. 'J I read about this in the papaer some time back. I think it was trialed in Swindon if i remember rightly. Anyone else with any ideas for my system?
camerabloke Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 why does it have to be noise? smokecloak do a high powered strobe that is not fit inducing (berfore anyone slates me) that disorientates you Eucam Security Systems 0845 4630 746 www.eucam.co.uk
Guest rjbsec Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 Try HERE three useful products available.
Guest Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 why does it have to be noise? smokecloak do a high powered strobe that is not fit inducing (berfore anyone slates me) that disorientates you Sorry but ex wife is Epileptic, ever seen a strobe work on someone like that? Its even used to test for the illness.
WatchdogSecurity Posted January 18, 2007 Posted January 18, 2007 Sorry but ex wife is Epileptic, ever seen a strobe work on someone like that? Its even used to test for the illness. Ive fitted a Master Blaster for Someone in there Workshop, he liked it that much he wanted one for his house, even after warning him etc he still had me fit it in his kitchen. Wooooo the windows flexed as it went off. LOL Watchdog Security (Manchester)
Smoke Screen Posted January 18, 2007 Posted January 18, 2007 Get in touch with me, and we can sort you out a quote in your market place. We also have regional support in Spain, and the most cost effective security smoke available anywhere in the world. All three of the products you mention are part of our range. Look forward to hearing from you. Best regards, Matt Gilmartin National Sales Manager Concept Smoke Screen +44 (0)1205 821 111 +44 (0)7973 305 839 Matt Gilmartin, Sales Director T: +44(01205) 821111 | F: +44(01205) 820316 info@smoke-screen.co.uk | www.smoke-screen.co.uk Head office: 1-2 North End, Swineshead, Boston, Lincs PE20 3LR Registered in the UK no. 2728491
arfur mo Posted January 18, 2007 Posted January 18, 2007 hi all, early days of my own firm i decided to hide a small pietzo sounder module (as an exit bleeper) beside a metal clad pab, when we tested the system. the noise level from that tiny bleeper was incredible, harmonics's bounced back of the 'sound board' pab, gining a really unexpected eye watering result. i also fitted an early gardtec siren above a shop door in Bond Street, this was on a piece of 15mm ply 3ft square board in a door recess, again when testing people on the other side of the road, even 2 turnings away covered their ears. so mounting even a standard warning device, it can be unexpectedly amplified depending on location, so if using an extra high power unit, think where it will be situated and if it will cause a problem. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!!
andyd Posted April 22, 2007 Posted April 22, 2007 Hello all.Firstly, I am not a security installer by trade. I sell solar power generation equipment in Spain. Nearly all of our clients are based in remote properties in the countryside. Conventional intruder alarm systems are not worth having in these areas and we have been trying to devise a system that may function better for these people. I heard about a device that got banned in UK some years ago that was a very loud internal sounder that dis-orientated the intruder, even possibly causing him/her pain and discomfort. Does anybody know where I could find these sounders?? Also I have found a company that manufactures smoke devices thatfill the room with smoke, after enquiring I have found out that these systems are very expensive to buy and they have a lot of stipulations on who they allow to buy and install them. The ideal system we would like to put together is as follows Very loud internal sounder, high frequency High wattage strobe Smoke device. Any advice will be greatly received. Thank you
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