Most Popular Intruder And Access Systems

[Cubit]

as im not an access control installer forgive me for the apparently dumb question but surely it is safer to disarm the system after the doors have been opened by the swipe card. what i mean is if joe bloggs the accountant of jb electronic manufacturers (yes its a false name) is on his way to work and gets mugged and beat up by two blokes that steals his wallet, cards and keys (hypothetically) and they know he has been working at that company jb electronics they can gain access to that premises that morning or night and then take whatever they like. i know it probably would never happen in the real world but has this been thought of or not??

and sorry if it sounds really stooopid

cjt

Hi Colin

My understanding of the situation is it's to do with the prevention of false alarms - and god knows what other obscure reasons that are buried in the intruder regs.

The system should not have all/most of the cards/fobs set to arm/disarm the intruder system, just the chosen few nominated staff - just as you would do with a non integrated system. Also, just presenting a token with 'keyhoder' permission to the door reader should not arm/disarm the intruder system, there should be a seperate primary action. If you didn't have this, how would the A/C system know whether to open the door or arm the panel??

There is also no reason why you can't have a zone in the intruder system for the relevant doors. Disarm the zone, swipe card, enter building, then disarm the rest of the system.

Andrew

[james.wilson]

i know scary isnt it, but do you beleive the insurance industry will not still insist on approved? both guards and systems? ISI and NSI joining together G4S rumoured to be coming back in a big way???

[Guest]

thanks for that andrew but does anyone see my point if one of staff members with access to the disarming and arming of I/A and also A/C systems and they get mugged for the keys/ fobs they have free rein so to speak. where as in my eyes if you have access control on the doors and then have to enter a code the people gaining access to premises will need to know that code to silence the alarm system.

do you see where im going or not?

All been discussed before. Not much can be done in certain circumstances as it's what the regs state, and as has been said, rules is rules.

[Guest]

thanks for that andrew but does anyone see my point if one of staff members with access to the disarming and arming of I/A and also A/C systems and they get mugged for the keys/ fobs they have free rein so to speak. where as in my eyes if you have access control on the doors and then have to enter a code the people gaining access to premises will need to know that code to silence the alarm system.

do you see where im going or not?

colin

Tell that to the punter who wants one fob for access and set/unsetting.

Or do you not do multiple entrance, group setting systems?

[Cubit]

thanks for that andrew but does anyone see my point if one of staff members with access to the disarming and arming of I/A and also A/C systems and they get mugged for the keys/ fobs they have free rein so to speak. where as in my eyes if you have access control on the doors and then have to enter a code the people gaining access to premises will need to know that code to silence the alarm system.

do you see where im going or not?

colin

If they've just mugged you because they know you work at the premises and they have your cards/fobs/keys etc is the little matter of 'persuading' you to divvie up the pin code going to deter them??... the pain will stop when you tell 'em the code.

I would there is also some thought to be given to the system dependant on company/personnel risk, the type of area etc.

Personnally i would not recommend this type of arm/disarm in some circumstances but from my limited knowledge of intruder regs i get the impression officer dibble would hhave all systems armed/disarmed from a prox reader externally.

For the record, and it ties in with your concern, our system requires a pin/prox reader on any doors that arm/disarm the intruder. Hopefully that should give a pointer.

Andrew

[Guest]

oh right like i said im not an access control man so i dont know much about it and thank god i dont it sounds like a headache.

I'm on about intruder alarms, not access control. But of course, you know this, what with not being a sparky who installs alarms.

[Guest]

sorry paul youve lost me on that

What part?

Multiple entrance buildings or group settings?

[Cubit]

oh right andrew from first reading it i read it as tho you just swiped the card the door unlocked, intruder alarm disarmed and you wlak in.

but thats clearer if you have a pin/prox reader on the door too.

thanks for clearing that up much appreciated

colin

and whjats to stop you giving them a false code.

You can still do zones too. Disarm 'reception' zone, swipe card, enter reception. Other areas can still be armed and can be armed/disarmed from Acc/Control system. Of course, if you don't have permission/rights to these other areas you ain't getting in them anyway.

And remember, you are getting an audit trail (in addition to any Intruder logs) of all these actions on the Access Control event logs.

Andrew

[Cubit]

and whjats to stop you giving them a false code.

Hi, Colin

Like i said, the pain may stop when you give them the code. I can't see a false code doing much for their sense of humour and tolerance. Yes, it may trigger a duress alarm but the is it really worth the pain??

Andrew

[Richard Huison]

Here's an idea, lets just use a Biometric Reader....................