Guest anguscanplay Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 in the alarm field perhaps it's a case of that same experience that you build up in intruder systems then prices you out of the market as an economically sound resource. lets face it, from an accountants point of view (and many firms rely on their opinions not bolshy engineers) lets say only 10% of all fault calls really require a top line engineer to attend and put right, but to have such quality guys costs money 100% of the time, that devours possible profits.my work type preference through and through is intruder systems, but door entry for instance is very uncomplicated. you don't really require a 24 hour service on most sites, setting up maintenance or 'piece of mind' deals is very lucrative, so a real no brainer imo to stay away from intruder especially if you want to make serious money for yourself without all the hassle. regs alan how many times have I said your all too cheap? stop competing on price alone, the money is there ( dont mean just you there Arfur ) we`ve argued this before A., by not doing annualls you are in real terms chasing new work every day just to stand still, only takes one new install a week to generate a days profit the next year - soon it snowballs and if your good ( and lucky, I will admit to been lucky too) you become self funding and don`t need to chase anymore. from the O/P`s point of view, whichever industry he enters - alarms, comms or fire, unless he`s at the top he isn`t going to get rich, might as well stay where he is.
arfur mo Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 how many times have I said your all too cheap? stop competing on price alone, the money is there ( dont mean just you there Arfur )we`ve argued this before A., by not doing annualls you are in real terms chasing new work every day just to stand still, only takes one new install a week to generate a days profit the next year - soon it snowballs and if your good ( and lucky, I will admit to been lucky too) you become self funding and don`t need to chase anymore. from the O/P`s point of view, whichever industry he enters - alarms, comms or fire, unless he`s at the top he isn`t going to get rich, might as well stay where he is. i agree with the sentiments, but while there are electricians, firemen and anybody else who see this trade as a source of 'on the side easy bunce', then how can you regulate it (price wise) in a free trade society? been said often enough in here to run a legit firm, fully insured and paying tax,s, hard to compete with the illicit bargain basement boys, the clients know no better they look at the price. when the recession hit the rag trade some ago, some Cypriot Greek clients i'd got to know through work were suffering real bad. like you in a way i asked them "why do you all fight to be cheaper and undercut each other, why not set up a rate and all agree to it?". the reply was "we do have a trade federation and big new meeting hall (Crouch End North London), where we all meet, discuss and agree what to do and what to charge, but as soon as we hit the fresh air and daylight that all gets forgotten, and we go on as usual. i'll put it this way, if the bomb dropped tomorrow and only two of us survived there would be three political parties". at first i laughed at the humour, then i realised the honesty and the irony, followed by the futility of anyone ever trying to change it. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!!
mjw Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 i agree with the sentiments, but while there are electricians, firemen and anybody else who see this trade as a source of 'on the side easy bunce', then how can you regulate it (price wise) in a free trade society? been said often enough in here to run a legit firm, fully insured and paying tax,s, hard to compete with the illicit bargain basement boys, the clients know no better they look at the price.when the recession hit the rag trade some ago, some Cypriot Greek clients i'd got to know through work were suffering real bad. like you in a way i asked them "why do you all fight to be cheaper and undercut each other, why not set up a rate and all agree to it?". the reply was "we do have a trade federation and big new meeting hall (Crouch End North London), where we all meet, discuss and agree what to do and what to charge, but as soon as we hit the fresh air and daylight that all gets forgotten, and we go on as usual. i'll put it this way, if the bomb dropped tomorrow and only two of us survived there would be three political parties". at first i laughed at the humour, then i realised the honesty and the irony, followed by the futility of anyone ever trying to change it. regs alan 'on the side easy bunce'..if you are doing this job correctley that is one thing it is'nt..thats another reason for licenses but that is another discussion for another time But as for the o/p i wish you luck BUT it is'nt going to be easy if for only reason the vetting
Guest anguscanplay Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 i agree with the sentiments, but while there are electricians, firemen and anybody else who see this trade as a source of 'on the side easy bunce', then how can you regulate it (price wise) in a free trade society? been said often enough in here to run a legit firm, fully insured and paying tax,s, hard to compete with the illicit bargain basement boys, the clients know no better they look at the price.regs alan Arfur, you not listening? why try and compete with them - we don`t. Educate your customers as Jeff was so fond of saying
mjw Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 Arfur, you not listening? why try and compete with them - we don`t. Educate your customers as Jeff was so fond of saying You may not compete,and that all well and good whilst the work is coming in through the door,but what happens when it STOPS?????.cos they can get it
Guest anguscanplay Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 You may not compete,and that all well and good whilst the work is coming in through the door,but what happens when it STOPS?????.cos they can get it
mjw Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 you want to be down at there level thats fine M, were positioned at the other end of the scale - like I said " why try and compete with them / on price......" you can`t, you compete on quality or service or timescale point I was making was Arf`s saying to the O/P forget alarms theres no money in it but there is as i said before its all well and good not going down to their level,but too prove you are a better quality company you have to get the job first and you know only too well 90% of the time it comes down too one thing..COST..so to sum up yep arfs sort of right and i hear what you are saying and you are also sort of right too
whistle Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 as i said before its all well and good not going down to their level,but too prove you are a better quality company you have to get the job first and you know only too well 90% of the time it comes down too one thing..COST..so to sum up yep arfs sort of right and i hear what you are saying and you are also sort of right too And the answer is, Get approved and do commercial with comms and a URN and charge a real price and make real money. SIMPLE
barooga Posted November 18, 2007 Posted November 18, 2007 Think some may be digressing here guys. The OP was looking for a job in the industry, not running his own business from day one. Whilst the points are valid, they won't apply directly to him. Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional
barooga Posted November 19, 2007 Posted November 19, 2007 Vetting Question Is it compulsory that people be vetted for employment as an engineer?? If so, any pointers to the relevant information?? Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional
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