arfur mo Posted January 17, 2008 Posted January 17, 2008 hi guys, had a prospective request to price for an expected expanding an existing 'voice over' evacuation system in a massive office building in central London today. no tarty flaming or religious 'regs lessons' please, just take it as read i'm acting seriously as a 'conduit' for my client, in order for him to do the same to his client. these works are within a parcel of other prospective very large works also to be quoted for. to start with, i'm not pretending to know anything other than a vey vague notion about them, and tbh i don't personally want to do the installation because it is way too big for this little 'one man band' even with my dog. it's expected to be approximately 600 extra speakers, no this is not a mis-print it's an extra 600 additional speakers and so i prefer to get in a bonifide firm who can handle and maintain a job of this size efficiently and without fuss, all the works will all be over weekends (and i don't do weekends noway ). i don't as yet have the make and model used, this is an early feeler enquiry just laying tentative tracks, so any pointers or contact from those in this field at this early stages would be very appreciated. please contact by pm if your interested but with respects no small firms or 'chancer's' please, should it become more likely then we can talk further, i don't like to or want to waste anybodies time - especially my own. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!!
AJP Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Hello, Systems that play a recorded message telling people to leave the building are usually referred to as "voice alarm" systems, that might help you search for companies. People usually work to BS5839 part 8 where it's the main way of getting people out of the building. On new installs or refit's there is often a firm of electricians on site who can put in loudspeaker cabling at the same time as putting in mains and other cables. Sometimes a PAVA contractor will fit and connect the loudspeakers to the cables afterwards. Every install I'v seen where the sparkys have put up the loudspeakers have needed some fault finding afterwards, varying from a few loose wires to a team running around for weeks. Having the electricians do it can go well if you have someone follow them around and flag faults as they go. Some systems use an end of line transponder to monitor the integrity of the loudspeaker lines so the lines are expected to be wired as one long line daisy chaining through each loudspeaker, rarther than wired with spurs branching off. My biggest grumble is that the as-wired diagrams go missing more often than not so it's much harder to fix simple faults later. For this size of install it is usuall for someone with a bit of expertise to plan the loudspeaker layout. On ocassion things happen like the client desciding to have enclosed offices instead of open plan desks but nobody thinks to put in more loudspeakers to get acceptable sound levels in offices with the doors shut. Sometimes the offices walls are filled with sound absorbing material and seal to provide privacy for meetings so they can't get away without a loudspeaker per office. I don't know if you need to handle the equipment side of things. Unless the extra loudspeakers have been allowed for in the installed equipment, you will need extra amplifiers and batterys. Some voice alarm systems are proprietary and not very easily expanded while maintaining the fault reporting. You may need someone with expertise in the paticular brand of equipment to do things like configure new zones or set up the monitoring for the extra loudspeakers. Adam Page
arfur mo Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Hi Adam, many thanks for your valuable input, the clients description for the system was used, i have precious little knowledge of such large voice systems used in this way - bet it don't show though the building is 'live' as in fully occupied, as you rightly say it is an expansion is caused mainly by redesigned office layouts. although i'm working beneath an electrical contractor they would not have the labour to run these cables, and tbh the size of the site i'd insist on specialists cable firm who would warranty their work and sort any problems on their installation as 'go backs' to rectify would be very time consuming. i'd doubt there is any existing wiring/equipment layouts in existence, even though the building is less than 18 months old as the original installers i believe have gone bust (i wonder why?), and as you prudently recommend i would be looking for a equipment specialist designer to do the design even provide the kit needed which will work with whats there already. regs alan (pm replied to) If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!!
esp-protocol Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 Hello Alan We do VA systems, usually use TOA equipment. You are going to need to know existing sizes of amplifiers/ battery standby etc etc as well as the perspective loads on the circuits etc to see if new kit is required. We can also handle the installation. Let me know if its of any use or email me. dave@ctafire.co.uk Regards Dave
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