Yoda Posted April 25, 2009 Author Posted April 25, 2009 ok, thanks to everyone who helped, and im not having a go, just trying to fully understand and so far your all doing a brilliant job! again thanks!! now following on to what has been said, i "think" we might still have crossed wires on understanding, now i accept i might be wrong, you guys after all are the more experienced! lol now on the main board inside the master box, not the control panel or expander, the master box, there are 8 zones built onto the board, each zone has 2 wire terminals, not the 4 as people are saying, which is where the confusion is, as people are saying A+T wiring but the master box does not detail any A+T terminal per zone, just 2 simple terminal per zone, labled z1 -> z8.... now how can i wire 4 cables into 2 terminals as people are sugesting? again thanks to those who have helped so far, i understand that this is not your diy kit, but i want to do this myself, its a personal thing!
magpye Posted April 25, 2009 Posted April 25, 2009 now on the main board inside the master box, not the control panel or expander, the master box, there are 8 zones built onto the board, each zone has 2 wire terminals, not the 4 as people are saying, which is where the confusion is, as people are saying A+T wiring but the master box does not detail any A+T terminal per zone, just 2 simple terminal per zone, labled z1 -> z8.... Are you calling the Keypad the Control Panel? It's NOT the Control Panel, it's a Remote Keypad, an on/off switch if you like, it is wired TO the Control Panel where the 8 (2 terminal) zones are, does that help a bit? Someone told me I was ignorant and apathetic, I don't know what that means, nor do I care.
Phaeton Posted April 25, 2009 Posted April 25, 2009 Okay I'll stick my neck out & expect it to be shot at I'm not a terrible experienced installer as most of my stuff has been access & CCTV but here goes. As I understand it there are 2 ways to wire the alarm & anti-tamper 4 Wire 2 wires go into the terminals on your main board, they go to the device & are connected across the alarm circuit, be that in the PIR or door contacts 2 wires go from the panel, this maybe separate terminals on the zone or you have to daisy chain all the zones together in a global tamper, these then go to the device. Effectively, if somebody removes the device or cuts the wire your panel will know this. The problem with this system is you do not know which circuit has the anti-tamper problem so diagnostics canbe fun. 2 Wire Only 2 wires go to the device, it uses resistors in the device, you put a 4K7 resistor across the alarm circuit & wire it through the anti-tamper as well like has been described before. You will normally have to tell the panel you have wired it this way. The panel will monitor each circuit, it will see the resistance of the line to the device, if the alarm circuit is triggered the resistance will change & the panel will see line resistance plus the 4K7 resistor & know it must trigger. If the device is removed or cable cut then it will loose all resistance & know it's anti-tamper. The advantage of this is the panel will tall you which circuit & whether it's triggered or anti-tampered. On a small system it's not hard to diagnose so 4 wire is easier to install, but on a large system it could be a nightmare. Alan...
BASS Posted April 25, 2009 Posted April 25, 2009 Yoda, guys here have fitted hundreds of systems & seen hundreds of Q's similar to yours about fitting systems.Remember the above and remember these were the 1st 3 replies in order to HELP you not FLAME you : "He who knows others is wise. He who knows himself is enlightened." You've tried DIY now it's time to GAMI "Get A Man In" GAMI hehe I Like It lol
ArsMoriendi Posted April 26, 2009 Posted April 26, 2009 For DiY (Destroy it Yourself) by far the the easiest way is 'double pole'2 wires for the 'contact pair' (A) & 2 wires for the 'tamper pair' (T) from each contact point back to the control panel. In the case of a detector of some sort, 6 wires, the two extra ones are for the 12v supply needed. This method is shown explicitly in the Premier 24 Installation Manual, page 17 of my copy, look for the Double Pole drawing magpye Hi magpye, I'm just in the process of deciding whether to get a prem24 or an excel for a DIY install. I like the radio fob you can add onto the prem24 so that might swing it... But looking at this PDF http://www.brewtime.co.uk/images/item/772.pdf it says the prem24 doesn't support double pole, either that or they forgot to colour the dot in. I take it the PDF is wrong, as your manual says it does, or - I'm missing the point and it means something else ? Ars
Rulland Posted April 26, 2009 Posted April 26, 2009 Prem 24 or Excel-there is no comparison-the 24 is way superior panel as far as domestic install goes-and is more than suitable for a business/commercial application-if you reckon you can do it go for it!.
breff Posted April 26, 2009 Posted April 26, 2009 Hi magpye,I'm just in the process of deciding whether to get a prem24 or an excel for a DIY install. I like the radio fob you can add onto the prem24 so that might swing it... But looking at this PDF http://www.brewtime.co.uk/images/item/772.pdf it says the prem24 doesn't support double pole, either that or they forgot to colour the dot in. I take it the PDF is wrong, as your manual says it does, or - I'm missing the point and it means something else ? Ars Prem 24 supports double pole, zones need to be programmed as 'normally closed' and tampers need to be series wired and connected to auxiliary tamper terminals. The opinions I express are mine and are usually correct! (Except when I'm wrong)(which I'm not)
ArsMoriendi Posted April 26, 2009 Posted April 26, 2009 Prem 24 or Excel-there is no comparison-the 24 is way superior panel as far as domestic install goes-and is more than suitable for a business/commercial application-if you reckon you can do it go for it!. Hi Rulland - but why is it superior ? Is it just tougher ? I'd want the metal one. I can see with the extra zones and extenders etc it'll cover a larger site than the Excel, but I don't need that. It's for a 4 bed semi. I like the extras I can bolt on when I feel like it, specifically the radio fob and receiver. Anyhow, what about the double pole thing ? The Texecom website says it won't do double pole either, but the manual says it does ?? http://www.texe.com/view.php?page=34&view=features# <-- no double pole !
ArsMoriendi Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 Prem 24 supports double pole, zones need to be programmed as 'normally closed' and tampers need to be series wired and connected to auxiliary tamper terminals. Thanks breff. Didn't see your reply hiding above mine there.
breff Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 Thanks breff. Didn't see your reply hiding above mine there. No Problem The opinions I express are mine and are usually correct! (Except when I'm wrong)(which I'm not)
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