norman Posted June 20, 2012 Posted June 20, 2012 Problem is, Jeff dresses it up, he should just say what he thinks.... Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.
CerbNI Posted June 21, 2012 Posted June 21, 2012 Using it without 'Mechanical' protection outside is very naughty. If it has to be ran outside treat it as the same for running below 2m height. e.g protected so no one can easily interfere with it. All MrHappy is saying is if you don't want it to fade, use white or black. However, if you remember under 5839 we are only permitted to use red. Stick it in some galv conduit, mark either end with a label. jobs a good-un. *my opinion, doesn't constitute legal advise yada yada* "......cables should preferably be red in colour for identification purposes" - preferred but not the only permitted colour.
james.wilson Posted June 21, 2012 Posted June 21, 2012 it should all be the same colour should it? securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount.
Scotmod Posted June 21, 2012 Posted June 21, 2012 Well there you go. YOUR WRONG! PVC/PVC cables are insulated then have mechanical insulation. MICC and SWA have ADDITIONAL mechanical protection. If you bother to read BS 7671 rather than quote good working practice then you would know it is quite within the scope of the BS (by way of example) to clip a 2.5 mm cable around the skirting board to feed a ring main of sockets. i like your thinking better than than BS 7671 While it might be protected enough under 7671 for a ring main then yes I would agree. However, we are talking about 5839 and fire alarms. It's hardly good working practice when it's required by the standard to be in some form of additional containment below 2m GH. it should all be the same colour should it? It should be all the same colour but I haven't seen any new installations where anyone has put in anything other than red for fire.
MrHappy Posted June 21, 2012 Posted June 21, 2012 While it might be protected enough under 7671 for a ring main then yes I would agree. I'd say no to T&E above a skirting Mr Veritas God
jb-eye Posted June 22, 2012 Posted June 22, 2012 While it might be protected enough under 7671 for a ring main then yes I would agree. However, we are talking about 5839 and fire alarms. It's hardly good working practice when it's required by the standard to be in some form of additional containment below 2m GH. It should be all the same colour but I haven't seen any new installations where anyone has put in anything other than red for fire. Now ihope you noted i said "i like your thinking better than than BS 7671"Anyway just for you: BS 5839 h) Except in particularly arduous conditions, mineral insulated copper sheathed cables conforming to BS EN 60702 and steel wire armoured cables conforming to BS 7846 may be used throughout all parts of the system without additional mechanical protection. Other cables should be given mechanical protection in any areas in which physical damage or rodent attack is likely. Particular consideration should be given to all areas that are less than two metres above floor level; other than in relatively benign environments (e.g. offices, shops and similar premises) in which cable is clipped directly to robust construction, mechanical protection should be provided in these areas. Protection may be provided by laying cable on tray, protecting it by burying in the structure of the building, or by installation in conduit, ducting or trunking. Where particularly arduous conditions might be experienced (such as impact by forklift trucks or goods trolleys), additional, robust protection should be given to all cables by burying the cable in the structure of the building or installation in metal conduit or trunking. IMO opinion if you stick to your beleif you will err on the side of good working practice BUT! plese dont declare your understanding as fact. Customers!
Adi Posted June 22, 2012 Posted June 22, 2012 I'd say no to T&E above a skirting Looked at a cctv job today, domestic, client told me to run mains under bedroom carpet, lol I really can't be ar**** with it anymore.
Rulland Posted June 22, 2012 Posted June 22, 2012 And did you?,I assume not,though have seen it done before!.
Adi Posted June 22, 2012 Posted June 22, 2012 its what the client wanted, i was a bit put off with the hump in the carpet though. Twatted it with a hammer for a bit, results were a bit shoddy to be fair, client wasnt bothered though. Reckon i should of used T&E instead of flex, would of had a flatter appearance and less chance of shorting the cores out/ruining the insulation as i wouldnt of had to hit it so much with the hammer. Ah well, you live and learn. I really can't be ar**** with it anymore.
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