Approved Co Ooop North

[matthew.brough]

As a nacoss firm i take the complete opposite opinion.

I'm not saying all NSI's companies are bad, but on our first NSI audit the inspector was so bothered about the most minute detail on paperwork and quite disinterested in the actual quality of the installation which I felt was plain wrong. I have had customers log complaints against NSI companies only to be wrote back to and told where to go, one of which was a national account. You must see other gold companies doing poor work and get away with it and feel frustrated NSI don't seem to be too interested in making them pull their socks up? Our SSAIB audit is due Wednesday and although fair, he is quite firm about the quality of work we do. We've never had any non-conformities raised and just 1 complaint but when a customer complained to SSAIB they were on it quickly whereas when I've seen companies write to NSI the initial resposne seems from them that one of their companies could never do anything wrong.

[Alarm Protection]

James as a SSAIB firm that has passed for the past 8 years what difference does it make?

This whole system is based on making money of every cert and we have to take in rule after rule to comply.

Insurance companies still don't have a clue what needs be to protect a building and everyone else gets away with it.

Don't get me wrong I make sure we comply to the rules but its gone way over the top.

[jb-eye]

I'm not saying all NSI's companies are bad, but on our first NSI audit the inspector was so bothered about the most minute detail on paperwork and quite disinterested in the actual quality of the installation which I felt was plain wrong. I have had customers log complaints against NSI companies only to be wrote back to and told where to go, one of which was a national account. You must see other gold companies doing poor work and get away with it and feel frustrated NSI don't seem to be too interested in making them pull their socks up? Our SSAIB audit is due Wednesday and although fair, he is quite firm about the quality of work we do. We've never had any non-conformities raised and just 1 complaint but when a customer complained to SSAIB they were on it quickly whereas when I've seen companies write to NSI the initial resposne seems from them that one of their companies could never do anything wrong.

 

 I make sure we comply to the rules but its gone way over the top.

It apears to me that so many companys have the WRONG idea about the inspection process. Its an AUDIT that makes use of a sampling system. If your going to CHEAT then the audit wont work.

The idea is a simple one where you open up your company and its systems for an independant review of your procedures offering a sample of your product (services). If your good at what you do then you welcome indipendant findings as a path to continual improvement and not as a critism. If you cherry pick then you have a crappy company with crappy procedures and systems and are doomed to long term failure.

Our industry had excellent indipendant policing and then was forced to introduce a second police force because the first was too strict for the majority of the industry is laughable and in this case has served to achieve nothing other than allow anyone with a screwdriver and a few DIY systems to compete on a level playing field (level was tonge in cheek)

[reidy]

INDEPENDENT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

       

[PeterJames]

It apears to me that so many companys have the WRONG idea about the inspection process. Its an AUDIT that makes use of a sampling system. If your going to CHEAT then the audit wont work.

The idea is a simple one where you open up your company and its systems for an independant review of your procedures offering a sample of your product (services). If your good at what you do then you welcome indipendant findings as a path to continual improvement and not as a critism. If you cherry pick then you have a crappy company with crappy procedures and systems and are doomed to long term failure.

Our industry had excellent indipendant policing and then was forced to introduce a second police force because the first was too strict for the majority of the industry is laughable and in this case has served to achieve nothing other than allow anyone with a screwdriver and a few DIY systems to compete on a level playing field (level was tonge in cheek)

QFA

It is very easy to cheat the system, NSI or SSIAB I know SSIAB and NSI companies that would never get approval if the inspector looked at every site they did. Wherase I know that we would not get grade A for every install we do, I would be worried if we did, but I let the inspectorate to choose which systems he wants to inspect, and when in comes to our own external audits we let our independant external auditer choose too. Worse we ever get is a C and thats normally down to a combination of my paperwork on the spec, and engineering. So I am confident that not all NSI golds are bad as I know of at least one thats quite good.

[Joe Harris]

If the police say the wont respond to intruder alarms they currently claim it costs how ever many million to do so. If they stop they will have an immediate budget cut

 

Though we are already saving for example, 21m+ a year for the MET police alone compared to a decade ago, this is due to work and improvements from the whole of our industry.

 

That said, the cost of a single police response of two officers to one alarm is likely to exceed the cost of the URN.  Would a private security firm be likely to give the same level of response on an ongoing, but below threshold, series of activations at a premises based on a single, one off charge for a URN?

 

Logic dictates that we need to continue to work closely with the police forces to help reduce their costs and minimise false alarms at an ever improving rate where possible.

 

 

Joe

[jb-eye]

INDEPENDENT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

       

You preffer impartial? No! Its independant! You can think of a better system.

And i couldnt give a stuff how much the inspectorates make.

[matthew.brough]

And i couldnt give a stuff how much the inspectorates make.

Agreed, after all they have bills to pay like the rest of us.

[MrHappy]

Our industry had excellent indipendant policing and then was forced to introduce a second police force because the first was too strict for the majority of the industry is laughable and in this case has served to achieve nothing other than allow anyone with a screwdriver and a few DIY systems to compete on a level playing field (level was tonge in cheek)

From my POV the two body & 2 tier system can all be traced back to the requirement for BS5750.

w/o the requirement for QA I'm certain we could have obtained & retained NSCIA, the QA at the time was specialist, expensive & totally unnecessary for co. with 3 staff. When ACPO was required to continue obtaining URN's we had the option to do NACOSS then QA with 24 months or go elsewhere, from a commercial point I think we made the correct choice as all those in my area came in at NACOSS (Rather than NSCIA) are dead & burried. We have recent(ish) NSI Gold however after the good work of obtaining it, they are allegedly having problems with non-compliances so it will be interesting to see whether they manage to retain it

[jb-eye]

We have recent(ish) NSI Gold however after the good work of obtaining it, they are allegedly having problems with non-compliances so it will be interesting to see whether they manage to retain it

 

But its no longer important to try to retain it. All they have to do is apply for SSAIB. So having failed to sort out Non compliances, they change to a policing system that accept they arent comply by whatever means. To be brutal if they are taking this path then they may as well just hide the Non compliance and stay Gold (statement derived from info read on this forum)