Ideas For Early Warning System To Protect When At Home

[swift]

Hope you guys had a good Christmas.

 

We have been living in the same house for over 25 years and haven't had any real incidents in that time. (We had a few prowlers in the back garden, but my father at the time heard some noise and manage to scare them off.)

We have a simple burglar alarm that was installed around 20 years ago.

We live in a fairly low crime area and in a fairly decent part of town and have come accustomed to it over the years.

 

I'm not sure if any burglar alarm system would have prevented this, correct me if I'm wrong, most alarms work on the basis, that the occupants are out of the house and thus the alarm is armed.  Or if the occupants of the house are upstairs, typically sleeping and the downstairs is then armed.

This happened at 5.30pm in the evening when wife and kids were in the lounge watching tv.  Can a burglar alarm prevent this?

 

In the days following, I did call a number of security installers in the area, told them what happened and left it to them to come with a solution to prevent this.  My only brief was I wanted some sort of perimeter protection to prevent this from ever happening again.

One simply came up with a 4 camera system using 520tvl cameras with 4 channel dvr (I think it was apollo).  A number of them came up with 5-6 cameras 600tvl with an 8-ch dvr (one of which was the alien) along with the gjd opal pir with the dygizone.  So while this was going on, I too was doing research and working out ideas myself on how best to protect my family and prevent this from happening again.  I was very much going down the gjd route, the only problem with it, was all that it would do was sound a bell to let you know someone  is on the property.  So what then? do you rush to the windows and have a look outside? rush over to the cctv monitor, turn it on, wait for it to come on? what if the cctv monitor is downstairs and your upstairs?

 

As well as the valuable time lost from the bell going off and trying to ascertain why the bell went off, the other important aspect is, the panic and fear that sets in upon hearing the bell till you can be certain it isn't anything serious.  Hence the design I came up with.  From the moment someone steps foot on my property, I want my family members to be able to determine in the shortest time possible who that foot belongs too.

 

This is why I was struggling with the gjd stuff and whilst researching I came across the product I did buy - not because it was cheap - because it fulfilled the requirements perfectly (something that some of you have alluded too, but failed to realise that is why I bought this and not because its cheap!) My thinking was, I will buy this and could get up and running quickly and could then take more time to  look for a more "pro" solution.  I too was worried by the cost differential between the gjd gear and this product and had some concerns the product would not be reliable and would get lots of false alarms and the range wouldn't be good.  I was proved wrong on all counts.  It has proved very reliable, we've had some pretty extreme weather which it has handled without fail, the false alarms have been very low - usually its a cat, (even the gjd pirs false alarms), and the range is pretty good  12-15 meters.

 

What I have bought is made by a British company, designed by British engineers and produced in British factories.  The price is what it is, because it's designed for the consumer market, whereas gjd gear and the like is designed for business - and anything designed for business is always a magnitude more expensive.

 

So over to you:

-> Is the design concept i.e. someone stepping foot on property and monitors coming on/off automatically within eyesight, is this in your opinion good - or is there a better design?

-> Can you put together and end-to-end solution that does the above or better?  

-> Any other ideas that would prove helpful as an early warning system?

-> If you can be honest and your ok with it, I'd be interested to know what you have in place, from how you get alerted?(e.g. gjd bell, mobile email/txt) to the steps you then have to take to ascertain who that person is on your property (e.g. goto room where cctv monitor and turn on etc?) for instance if you are asleep and its 3am?

-> Can someone please change the title to 'Early Warning System' or similar please, thx.

 

 

 

[james.wilson]

The price is what it is, because it's designed for the consumer market, whereas gjd gear and the like is designed for business - and anything designed for business is always a magnitude more expensive.

Your confusing professional gear with consumer gear.

In all industries consumer stuff is like that, networking, security, cleaning product.

We wont touch consumer stuff because its actually more expensive with the issues due to labour costs. We need something to 'just work' first time every time etc.

 

I would also say you were talking to the wrong people. There are many solutions and id say none of them are cctv only.

 

 

-> Is the design concept i.e. someone stepping foot on property and monitors coming on/off automatically within eyesight, is this in your opinion good - or is there a better design?

 

While the theory is sound long term it wont work, due to reliability issues, human nature, false alarms and nuisance alarms etc etc.

Im guessing as they were let in? id be concentrating on this area as well as the perimeter.

 

 

 

-> Can you put together and end-to-end solution that does the above or better?  

Yes

 

 

 

-> If you can be honest and your ok with it, I'd be interested to know what you have in place, from how you get alerted?(e.g. gjd bell, mobile email/txt) to the steps you then have to take to ascertain who that person is on your property (e.g. goto room where cctv monitor and turn on etc?) for instance if you are asleep and its 3am?

My system i have at home isnt designed with your risk high on the list. 

I have cctv all round the property, movement sensors outside linked to my intruder alarn that alert me to someone on the property. Obviously the drive one is usually the postman, gardener, delivery driver etc rather than anything to worry about. However if my sides or rear were tripped id be more concerned. I can get an email but dont enable it. Purly use the speech system to tell me which has triggered. If i wanted to i can use any of the tv's on my intereconnected media system to display my cameras. This is fine if wathcing telly but i usually look out of the window to be fair. I have a police response intruder alarm with a mix of movement sensors and perimeter protection. I also have panic buttons in the hallway and main bedroom.

 

Its hard to really say without seeing the risk but to generalise and make assumptions on the property id do things in this order.

 

• Police response intruder alarm with full perimeter protections (ie vibration and contact detectors on all door and windows) This could then be armed when your family was in.
• Create an external perimeter that can be protected with monitored cctv and challange visitors at this perimeter and not the door,
• Intercom system so that you dont open the door to visitors without challenging them.
• PA Buttons in risk areas and at each intercom handset location (silent PA with confirm for police calling)
• Perimeter active beams linked to the internal alarm but not for police calling.
• CCTV to monitor the activation reason and give general survillance.
• Connect CCTV to monitoring station with internal abort button so people at home can cancel genuine activations.

But id be focusing on the intruder alarm and Hold up alarms first with a URN. 

 

 

 

Can someone please change the title to 'Early Warning System' or similar please, thx.

yes

[swift]

James, thank you for providing an excellent, detailed and candid post.

 

Your confusing professional gear with consumer gear.

In all industries consumer stuff is like that, networking, security, cleaning product.

We wont touch consumer stuff because its actually more expensive with the issues due to labour costs. We need something to 'just work' first time every time etc.

 

I think you've hit the nail on the head there and is probably where probably much of the confusion on my part has been regarding cameras on the other thread.  Whereas, I'm quite happy with consumer gear, you guys being professionals are not - perhaps just like cameramen use professional cameras and not consumer cameras.

 

 

 

I would also say you were talking to the wrong people. There are many solutions and id say none of them are cctv only.

They were NACOSS/NSI type.  There was one very good chap who came out and demo'd an ip 1.3MP Lilin camera and a standard analogue camera 600tvl type along with the alien eko dvr.  Once I saw the picture of the megapixel camera the analogue one just looked awful.  He recommended I'd wait a couple of months as prices were coming down and new gear was coming out.

 

 

 

 

Im guessing as they were let in? id be concentrating on this area as well as the perimeter.

No they were not let in.  They got in through the front door - we were pretty sure the front door was locked, but as there was no sign of forced entry, Police are saying the front door must have been left unlocked.

 

 

My system i have at home isnt designed with your risk high on the list. 

I have cctv all round the property, movement sensors outside linked to my intruder alarn that alert me to someone on the property. Obviously the drive one is usually the postman, gardener, delivery driver etc rather than anything to worry about. However if my sides or rear were tripped id be more concerned. I can get an email but dont enable it. Purly use the speech system to tell me which has triggered. If i wanted to i can use any of the tv's on my intereconnected media system to display my cameras. This is fine if wathcing telly but i usually look out of the window to be fair. I have a police response intruder alarm with a mix of movement sensors and perimeter protection. I also have panic buttons in the hallway and main bedroom.

 

Its hard to really say without seeing the risk but to generalise and make assumptions on the property id do things in this order.

 

• Police response intruder alarm with full perimeter protections (ie vibration and contact detectors on all door and windows) This could then be armed when your family was in.
• Create an external perimeter that can be protected with monitored cctv and challange visitors at this perimeter and not the door,
• Intercom system so that you dont open the door to visitors without challenging them.
• PA Buttons in risk areas and at each intercom handset location (silent PA with confirm for police calling)
• Perimeter active beams linked to the internal alarm but not for police calling.
• CCTV to monitor the activation reason and give general survillance.
• Connect CCTV to monitoring station with internal abort button so people at home can cancel genuine activations.

But id be focusing on the intruder alarm and Hold up alarms first with a URN. 

 

Thanks for this, it looks like I need to get you in - but not sure if I'm going to be able to afford the bill.

This is a great list of advice and will look to implement as much as I can.  I was working on an outside-in approach i.e. get boundaries secure and work inwards. I'm very much looking at beams, was thinking of having a pair at the property boundary and then a further pair nearer the steps to the front door.  I was going down the dedicated PA system with buttons in all major rooms.  Didn't know about the silent PA will look into that.  Will look into an integrated intruder alarm system.  

When you say the intruder alarm could be armed when family is in, not sure how this would work - for instance, family members going in/out the front door several times a day - would they need to manually disarm the front door before opening and then re-arm the front door? I can't see this working for very long given human behaviour, plus kids in house.

[Ronnie]

is there a chance of the same thing happening again?

[jb-eye]

is there a chance of the same thing happening again?

would you take the chance it won't?

RA at home isn't a formal decision, when my children where living at home I did escape briefings in case of a fire. The children's rooms were all on the second floor and only the stairs are excesable to which end we had a rope ladder loaded into a steel container. It couldn't be accessed without sounding an alarm. I even explained roof void access and smashing through plasterboard walls/ceilings.

Thankfully it was never required and today we joke about those things.

This post caused me to fix a camera I have which has been down for some months. I don't have any special reasons for feeling threatened but there are some nutter out there.

[Oxo]

Just a small addition, if you do go for the door entry , which is a must in these circumstances. Do not use any opening devices on the doors. Use standard (See below) locks, as any (Unless you spend as much as a door in some cases) only need a good shove to over come.

Personally in 99% of cases this is the way I go.

 

Also retro fit "Anti slip " Deadlatches and 6 pin "anti bump" cylinders.

[swift]

is there a chance of the same thing happening again?

don't want to tempt fate by saying anything.  The reason why it happened was - Gold.  There is a silent epidemic sweeping the country, not much in the way of media coverage or Police doing much about it.  Armed gangs up and down the country are targeting asian gold shops and asian families.  

 

Just a small addition, if you do go for the door entry , which is a must in these circumstances. Do not use any opening devices on the doors. Use standard (See below) locks, as any (Unless you spend as much as a door in some cases) only need a good shove to over come.

Personally in 99% of cases this is the way I go.

 

Also retro fit "Anti slip " Deadlatches and 6 pin "anti bump" cylinders.

 

Did some research on this in the days following the incident, try to work out if they could have got in if the door was locked and no sign of forced entry. Was absolutely shocked to  see just how easy it was to get into doors with euro-cylinder locks.  Youtube is full of lock bump videos showing just how easy it is to gain entry and ebay selling bump keys.  There is also lock snapping.  So yes I have replaced all locks with anti-bump and anti-snap locks as well put sash jammers on all doors.

Some dvrs have an intercom facility so was going to see how good that was, if not, get a dedicated intercom system.

[norman]

don't want to tempt fate by saying anything.  The reason why it happened was - Gold.  There is a silent epidemic sweeping the country, not much in the way of media coverage or Police doing much about it.  Armed gangs up and down the country are targeting asian gold shops and asian families.  

It was covered on our local news yesterday (Yorkshire) and I am aware of a wave of jewellers being targeted recently.

[MrHappy]

The reason why it happened was - Gold.  There is a silent epidemic sweeping the country, not much in the way of media coverage or Police doing much about it.  Armed gangs up and down the country are targeting asian gold shops and asian families. 

 

TBH if I've been aware of it for some time its hardly a secret, I assume Nottingham is large enough to have a safety deposit centre ?

 

If its tradition to have more gold in your house than MR T spending  £500.00 or so to keep it off site might be a worth while investment. 

[james.wilson]

Id guess the gold is insured its the family where the concern comes from?