Intruder Alarm In Toilet Area?

[matt6697]

Hi All, 

 

Just gone out to provide a quote for an install using existing cables.  

 

Now the existing panel was positioned within a walk in cupboard that is currently been converted into a toilet area including a wash basin(no shower or bath).

 

Now I said to the client I can install the panel else where but they want it to stay where it was originally.

 

Now I understand that a bathroom including a bath/shower would defiantly come under a notifiable job under part p, and all electrics should be at least IP33 rated.

 

would an area with a toilet & sink be ok?, or would this still be a problem?

[Simlec]

It's only notifiable within the zones (not the room) shown in the approved doc P. As your room is only a toilet and wash basin then crack on and use common sense with placement.

[datadiffusion]

President was established years ago when an NICEIC member was fined for putting sockets in a full height off-bathroom airing cupboard IIRC?

But appealed and totally exonerated. I.e walk in cupboard is NOT a Bathroom, even if it leads off a bathroom. It's a 'room'.

 

Afraid I don't have a link though.

 

However, I now realise I misread your OP anyway.

 

A toilet and basin does not a bathroom make.

 

And, don't forget, like for like replacement, especially an end device, is NOT covered under Part P.

[Simlec]

President was established years ago when an NICEIC member was fined for putting sockets in a full height off-bathroom airing cupboard IIRC?

But appealed and totally exonerated. I.e walk in cupboard is NOT a Bathroom, even if it leads off a bathroom. It's a 'room'.

 

Afraid I don't have a link though.

 

However, I now realise I misread your OP anyway.

 

A toilet and basin does not a bathroom make.

 

And, don't forget, like for like replacement, especially an end device, is NOT covered under Part P.

It would be if the items were in the zones shown in the doc P.

Remember its not the room its the zones. So a room containing a bath/shower is not notifiable but if you do any work within the zones around the bath/shower they are.

e.g. So if you install a mirror light on the bathroom wall from an existing circuit and no cabling or accessories are in or go through the zones then it's not notifiable.

People including most sparks think because its a bathroom its notifiable which is not the case.

Op. you also need to brush up on your IP knowledge with regards zones.

[datadiffusion]

And, don't forget, like for like replacement, especially an end device, is NOT covered under Part P.

 

l should have clarified, providing the original installation met the standard at the time. And yes, we have zones

now, although that still feels like a 'new thing' to me, showing my age...

 

Of course, if some idiot fixes a 2G socket on the wooden side panel of a bath (which I've seen, OMG...) 

that's not a free pass to carry on.

 

A good example would be the continued use of fusewire CUs or the like for like replacement of T+E on a catenery, I guess.

Edited October 24, 2015 by datadiffusion

[Simlec]

Yes the older consumer units with fuse wire are fine but the problem is everything within especially a domestic property has to have RCD protection nowadays unless you go out of your way to eliminate the requirements for it. 

Data, you should not realy use T+E on a catenary wire system or outside as it has no UV protection.

[datadiffusion]

Data, you should not realy use T+E on a catenary wire system or outside as it has no UV protection.

 

Would never and have never done it.

 

But I would say a good example where it was allowed under old regs, many 70's houses around here have it to outbuildings,

and as far as I understand, if done with storm loops and earthed catenery, a householder could legitimately replace, like for like,

without having to notify and without breaking any rules.

Yes the older consumer units with fuse wire are fine but the problem is everything within especially a domestic property has to have RCD protection nowadays

 

But, my point is, there is NO regulation forcing such a building to be upgraded.

 

http://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/mediafile/100423440/Best-Practice-Guide-1-Issue-3-.pdf(point 1.3)

Edited October 24, 2015 by datadiffusion

[Simlec]

As long as it's safe for continued services then fine, but all additions, alterations and new works must conform to current BS7671 so to avoid having lots of separate boxed with RCD'S in is sometimes cheaper and quicker to change CU to a new one. + they should be safer (& metal from 1st jan 2016)

[datadiffusion]

Yep, but I'm talking about like-for-like replacements to existing installations.

 

And metal CU's are only one of 3 possible solutions (though I accept 'total enclosure' is probably not very likely, though it was used in boiler cabinets for years)

Edited October 24, 2015 by datadiffusion

[Simlec]

Yep, but I'm talking about like-for-like replacements to existing installations.

 

And metal CU's are only one of 3 possible solutions (though I accept 'total enclosure' is probably not very likely, though it was used in boiler cabinets for years)

and what's the other one? metal, fire enclosure and ?