NACOSS/SSAIB

[Guest simmo]

Good day to all, thought I would post this in the members area to kick off. I have been running my own security company for the last 6 months, mainly in alarm installation. Take up has been slow but steady, with word of mouth now starting to filter me in more jobs. My question is I am currently not an approved installer. Obviously I have looked into the issue, and the costs involved. I would appreciate some impartial advice from any members with regards to NACOSS/SSAIB. Such as which is the best to join and why? What experience or advice have other people out there had with the inspection process? You get the idea.

I am an ex-copper, and I'm currently finding that as soon as I get my foot in the door I'm normally selling my systems based on that reputation. Obviously cost is a factor, and has anybody got any suggestions as to how to cover 24hr callout with regards to being an approved installer whilst being a sole trader? Can I use a sub-contractor?

Site looks interesting would appreciate any comments. Thanks

[Service Engineer]

NACOSS and SSAIB should now be regarded as equal by Insurance companies, so in theory there is little to choose between the two, the only problem here is that a lot of insurance companies are still specifying/favouring NACOSS over SSAIB and thats ashame, as you probably know there is no difference in the way the alarms are installed, only in the way the installation company is inspected.

Basically with an SSAIB approved company the installations are the main thing inspected, with a NACOSS company Installations and Book keeping are inspected.

For a new Company I would recommend becoming SSAIB installed in the first instance, as you are still able to do everything a NACOSS company can and also the SSAIB is cheaper. If you then expand the company and feel the need then you could opt to become NACOSS approved at a later date.

As for covering out of hours callouts, I cant see any reason why sub contractors cant be used, except for the fact they would need to be police screened.

Once you have become approved by your choosen governing body, its a good idea to get any one who may do work for you screened first regardless of whether you become approved anyway.

[Guest simmo]

for the advice, as you stated SSAIB seems the way to go, any tips for the inspection process?

Thanks

[Service Engineer]

The only tips I can give really are to make sure that any installations you have done fully comply with the relevant British Standards, including any systems you may have taken over, and that all sites have a wiring schedule and service records.

You should also have catalogued files of any systems you are dealing with, the inspector will choose several random sites for the inspection, and usually expect to see you fully service at least one of these sites on the day of inspection.

By the way Simmo I liked your site, not too fancy and not too complicated. Well Done.

[Guest simmo]

Thanks Dave,

Its nice to know all those hours sweating over Frontpage were not wasted.

I'm pretty happy all my installations are up to BS spec, although I must admit I don't posses a copy! However I've done enough work whilst as a subbie for SSAIB firms so no probs there.

With regard to Wiring Schedules, I presume this is the normal document handed over, listing what each zone is etc or is this something totally different?

Still trying to get round using someone else for the 24hr cover, but hopefully I'll apply for approval status in approx 8-12months.

Thanks for the help, much appreciated. Sorry if they are obvious questions, but if you don't ask you will never learn.

Simmo

[Service Engineer]

Same here Simmo, just cant seem to use Dreamweaver very well. Frontpage is good enough for me too.

The wiring schedule I was refering to was a complete listing of cables and wires going into the main control panel, I actually think its a requirement, and it does come in very handy.

Basically you number all the cables and then state how they are wired and what detector they go to, its good practise to list the zone and tamper resistances for future fault finding purposes.

At the bottom of each sheet I would include the customers name, the installers name, aux, sab, and battery voltages, the standby, alarm and quiescent current draws, the entry and exit times, any part setting options and any other information that another engineer may find useful. etc etc.

example:

Wire 1: Lounge Pir: Red+ Black - | Green & White = Zone 1 | Blue & Yellow = Tamper

The idea behind this type of schedule is to help another engineer quickly determine where any fault may lie, if your thinking of using Sub-contractors for callouts etc etc, they will find all this information invaluable and very time saving. I usually list what each zone is programmed as also.

You should also include Historical Records:

This will detail the complete history of the alarm system from Day1, including any work carried out such as routine services, callouts, parts replaced, etc etc.

Hope this helps.

[Guest simmo]

Thanks Dave,

I'm doing something similar already, although I'll amend that now, and make it a little more detailed. I normally label up all my cables, although I can see the relevance of having that on paper also. Good point re the subbies. Impressed with the site, I can imagine many hours of sweat went into it.

Thanks again

Simmo

[Service Engineer]

Glad you liked the Website, its not as popular as my last venture but its doing as well as i expected, and getting more visitors every day.

Glad to see your gonna update your wiring schedule and control panel logs, its always a good idea to keep these anyway. The extra 1/2 hour it takes after the initial installation of the alarm system can save you hours at a later date.

[Guest TheHat]

example:

Wire 1: Lounge Pir: Red+ Black - | Green & White = Zone 1 | Blue & Yellow = Tamper

This is not what an Inspectore looks for.

They are not interested in what colours you use for the connections, they are interested in what the Resistance of the cable runs are, before the detection device is connected. The cable connections should be identified in your Work Instructions Manual and should be standard throughout your installations. Your Systems readings Sheet should also include Voltage Readings and Current Readings, it would be a good idea to get a copy of the relevant standards of BS4737 and have a read.

A point on Sub-Contarctors is that they "Cannot carry out Service or Maintenance work" so to use them for Call-Outs is not possible, Sub-Contractors can only be used for the Installation process and must not be involved in the Commissioning of a system either.

NACOSS also have another Inspectorate called ICON, check their web site for details.

Regards

TheHAt

[Guest simmo]

Had a look at the ICON stuff, its certainly seems comparible to SSAIB. However I've just had my yellow pages bill, so I may have to sit on the fence for a bit before I can afford approval status!

As a new start-up company I may wait for a bit to see how the European regs impact on the industry. I don't want to lay out for two sets of books!

Otherwise it looks like I'm going to have to approach another approved company to cover call out when I can't, this looks like the only way forward when I get busy enough.

fellas

Have a good Easter

Simmo B)