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Posted

Only a proper fire alarm or interlinked smokes met with building regs,

 

If you want smokes on intruder alarm I buy Texecom ones however I have used S65 with the relay base in the past

Mr th2.jpg Veritas God

Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, MrHappy said:

Only a proper fire alarm or interlinked smokes met with building regs,

 

 

smoke detectors connected to an intruder alarm does comply with grade C of 5839 (unless im reading it wrong). mains interlinked smoke detectors are grade D

 

Quote

Grade c: A system of fire detectors and alarm sounders (which may be combined in the form of smoke alarms) connected to a common power supply, compromising the normal mains and a standby supply, with central control equipment

 

but one major issue is backup time, needs to be 72 hours so you will need an extra few batteries

 

from 5839-6:2013

 

Quote

NOTE For intruder alarm systems, BS EN 50131-1 recommends a standby capacity of
less than 72 h. Modifications to an intruder alarm system are, therefore, likely to be
necessary if it is to incorporate a fire detection and alarm facility complying with the
recommendations of this standard for a Grade C system.

 

Edited by andy™
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, andy™ said:

 

smoke detectors connected to an intruder alarm does comply with grade C of 5839 (unless im reading it wrong). mains interlinked smoke detectors are grade D

 

 

but one major issue is backup time, needs to be 72 hours so you will need an extra few batteries

 

from 5839-6:2013

 

 

 

Indeed but in a similar manner to UK exemptions for intruder standby time, when it was a new build / refurb / loft extension prompted job we told BC that any low batteries would be notified by the alarm panel in plain English and that a maint contract existed for at least the first 12 months they were happy to sign off... and noted as a variation.

 

3 minutes ago, Shaunb1905 said:

Must be mental using twinflex!! 

 

Whilst I've only used them about 3 times, I think Fike are excellent, guessing you've had issues?

Edited by datadiffusion

So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

Posted
28 minutes ago, andy™ said:

 

smoke detectors connected to an intruder alarm does comply with grade C of 5839 (unless im reading it wrong). mains interlinked smoke detectors are grade D


A proper fire alarm has fire fire resistant cabling

 

Mains interlinked has a battery in each device,

 

An intruder alarm has combustible cable & a sounder separate from the sensor, I think its bad idea to use an intruder alarm for life safety

 

Mr th2.jpg Veritas God

Posted (edited)

not according to 5839-6

 

Quote

16.1 Commentary
A fire detection and fire alarm system in which components are interconnected will
not fulfil its functions unless these interconnections operate correctly. In most
systems, the interconnections take the form of wiring, but other means, such as
radio signals, may be used. Recommendations for radio-linked systems are given in
Clause 21.
In most single-family dwellings, any interconnections between components are not
required to function for prolonged periods during a fire. Accordingly, the use of
fire-resisting cables might not be necessary. However, wiring needs to be protected
from exposure to mechanical damage, particularly if the wiring is unmonitored.

 

 

16.4 Recommendations for wiring in Grade C systems
The following recommendations are applicable.
a) The electrical characteristics of the cables used in Grade C systems should be
in accordance with the relevant recommendations of BS 7671. The cables
should be suitable for the current and voltage of the circuits concerned.

 

makes no mention of fire resistant cable. for grade A & B it does state fire resistant cable required

 

then there is also this

 

Quote

Grade C systems can incorporate even simpler CIE, providing a source of power for
either a number of smoke alarms (and, possibly, heat alarms) or a number of fire
detectors, with a very basic form of control and indication. Such equipment can
comprise, for example, equipment specifically intended to provide a central source
of power and control for interconnected smoke alarms, or can, for example,
comprise the CIE of an intruder alarm system or social alarm system, to which a
number of fire detectors and fire alarm devices are connected. Facilities provided by
the CIE in a Grade C system may also include some facilities that are, more typically,
provided in the CIE of Grade A and Grade B systems, which will satisfy all
recommendations in respect of CIE for Grade C systems.

 

 

like it or not, thats what the regs say

 

personally, i almost always fit grade D using Aico detectors

Edited by andy™
Posted
3 hours ago, MrHappy said:


A proper fire alarm has fire fire resistant cabling

 

Mains interlinked has a battery in each device,

 

An intruder alarm has combustible cable & a sounder separate from the sensor, I think its bad idea to use an intruder alarm for life safety

 

So just stick with a standard battery powered device??

Posted
3 hours ago, MrHappy said:


A proper fire alarm has fire fire resistant cabling

 

Mains interlinked has a battery in each device,

 

An intruder alarm has combustible cable & a sounder separate from the sensor, I think its bad idea to use an intruder alarm for life safety

 

If i got hold of some FP200  what would you say the best way to install a device would be? From a mains perspective...

 

 

Posted

We didn't know what the property was from the OP.

Yes, I have serviced many a fire alarm in domestic properties, however all have been detached properties of various sizes.

 

Mr. H hits the nail on the head as usual, should really be mains interlinked.

Mains interlinked would be installed with 3C&E mains cable.

 

Would use Alarmsense over Twinflex, DD.

Posted
1 minute ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

We didn't know what the property was from the OP.

Yes, I have serviced many a fire alarm in domestic properties, however all have been detached properties of various sizes.

 

Mr. H hits the nail on the head as usual, should really be mains interlinked.

Mains interlinked would be installed with 3C&E mains cable.

 

Ideally on a dedicated circuit and not a spur of another?

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