Specialist Posted July 5, 2019 Posted July 5, 2019 2 hours ago, sixwheeledbeast said: Still missing something here, why disconnect them in the first place? Question has been raised several times but still not answered. I sure wouldn't want my fire safety to be reliant on cheap tat detectors. Quote Customers Love us, Intruders Hate us.
Reddwarf4ever Posted July 6, 2019 Author Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) Hello my alarm system and Smoke detectors are 25 years old, I have been told max life for smokes is 7 years, that’s why I am removing them, I plan to fit standalone fire angel dual detection smoke alarms, as recommended by the fire brigade. currently deciding whether to replace a ‘ repaired’ control panel, two keypads & two wired bell boxes .....and keeping the existing hall sounder 8 PIR’s and 3 contacts... because if I have the control panel replaced, the smokes will be removed in the process and save paying for the smokes to be removed now and later an Upgrade...... this is from my original install company ( who charge £200 / Hr ) The Main control panel we now use is a Pyronix Euro 46 8 zone control panel, For a Pyronix Euro 46 panel, keypad and battery you are looking at £300 fitted, extra keypads cost £80, Live bell boxes cost £120 Everything is plus VAT......so would be £620 plus VAT. = £744.....( looking at the wording, there may be extra labour to fit the extra keypad and bell boxes, starting to get expensive ) still waiting for the quote from the other alarm company who charge £85 / Hr....this company got me out of trouble once by repairing a blown PSU in my control panel.....wasn’t very expensive as I remember....and done some tidying of the programming......stopped part set making so many beeps before activating etc etc....so,I trust them. Edited July 6, 2019 by Reddwarf4ever Quote
sixwheeledbeast Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 Most manufacturers of detectors set a 10 year life expectancy, however they should be functionally tested regularly (a test button is not functional test). You would be lucky to get 4 years out of a Fire Angel and then they are for the bin. If you replaced the smokes for a modern type something like an Aico you could keep the alarm connection, have stand alone sounding and be able to swap the heads in the future. I would say the only issue you have is the smokes are so old you can't get replacement heads for them. All of this doesn't consider regular testing that you would get from having smokes connected to the alarm on a service, you wouldn't have that with the Fire Angels. Quote
Reddwarf4ever Posted July 6, 2019 Author Posted July 6, 2019 Do the aico ones have dual detection, heat plus ionising ? May consider replacing with mains ones, will see how much the alarm company want for them, but would prefer dual detection...... thanks Quote
sixwheeledbeast Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 Optical is more of a general purpose detector, ionisation would be more suited to bedrooms heat for kitchens and garages. Ionisation normally have a lower life expectancy. Mains ones could get expensive. Would use 180 Series myself. Quote
Reddwarf4ever Posted July 6, 2019 Author Posted July 6, 2019 Thanks i was previously planning to remove the smokes from the system myself and find a way t disconnect the cables. looks like I will pay for some help, but managed to remove the first smoke detector using engineer mode, but now can’t work out how to make it active again ( unremove it) can you help me with the steps in engineer mode to a ode to activate this smoke again p l e a s e Quote
MrHappy Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 In the pub... 14 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said: Hello my alarm system and Smoke detectors are 25 years old, I have been told max life for smokes is 7 years, that’s why I am removing them, I plan to fit standalone fire angel dual detection smoke alarms, as recommended by the fire brigade. currently deciding whether to replace a ‘ repaired’ control panel, two keypads & two wired bell boxes .....and keeping the existing hall sounder 8 PIR’s and 3 contacts... because if I have the control panel replaced, the smokes will be removed in the process and save paying for the smokes to be removed now and later an Upgrade...... this is from my original install company ( who charge £200 / Hr ) The Main control panel we now use is a Pyronix Euro 46 8 zone control panel, For a Pyronix Euro 46 panel, keypad and battery you are looking at £300 fitted, extra keypads cost £80, Live bell boxes cost £120 Everything is plus VAT......so would be £620 plus VAT. = £744.....( looking at the wording, there may be extra labour to fit the extra keypad and bell boxes, starting to get expensive ) still waiting for the quote from the other alarm company who charge £85 / Hr....this company got me out of trouble once by repairing a blown PSU in my control panel.....wasn’t very expensive as I remember....and done some tidying of the programming......stopped part set making so many beeps before activating etc etc....so,I trust them. Given the cost of the kit, there not a high about of money if your employing... Quote Mr Veritas God
datadiffusion Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, sixwheeledbeast said: You would be lucky to get 4 years out of a Fire Angel and then they are for the bin. I made an easy call out the other day, look after a block that has our system in the communal area plus heats inside each flat lobby. Called out by block manager for 'your fire system false alarming' complaint from tenant which I was suspicious about as the site is on comms and no other complaints. Landlord who had turned down our quote to replace in-situ Aico had put fire angels in every sodding room including the lobby next to ours. Looks to me as if triggered by sunlight (massive full height uncurtained window). Landlord has removed that alarm, which isn't even needed, no more false alarms, block manager has passed invoice for false callout to landlord and paid in full. (I should point out that the 'lobby' really is a tiny unfurnished lobby and the flats Aico is quite correctly in what should be considered the flats corridor) 49 minutes ago, MrHappy said: Given the cost of the kit, there not a high about of money if your employing... I don't understand why the gardtec is being replaced in that quote? I know Gardtec is ancient but 840 was top of the line, metal case etc... & so personally I would be happy to support it with a caveat it could conk out at any time with no spares availability. I am not sure where the 7 years for smokes has come from, most smoke detectors as has been pointed out will have an expiry date printed on which is usually ten years. As has been pointed out, there are no batteries to fail, a modern 12v optical detector in a domestic setting will easily reach this lifetime and maybe more provided it has regular smoke-simulation testing. https://uk.eaton.com/content/gb/en/products/product-catalog/scantronic-Menvier-security-multifunctional-fire-detector-alarm.html Edited July 6, 2019 by datadiffusion Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands
sixwheeledbeast Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 Only ever had Fike stuff FA from light levels Quote
datadiffusion Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) 53 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said: Only ever had Fike stuff FA from light levels Yes, I had it from an ancient (15 year old) cheapo fluro lamp actually (on Fike). But the way the sun reflected through this floor to ceiling uncurtained window at the same time of day as the FA, and the fact there clearly was no fire, I can't think what else it could be. I have also been out to several 3-5 year old Fire Angels badged with local brigade logo where the 10 year battery has already failed. The latest fad is brigade badged teabags ('test your alarm whilst the kettle boils') to be fair the tea is quite decent. Edited July 6, 2019 by datadiffusion Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands
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