Which Honeywell Panel in UK? - Gave up waiting for Konnected.io

[jelockwood]

I have scanned most of this thread but not all as it was taking excessively long to load in my browser.

 

I am also interested in a Honeywell Galaxy for use in the UK and for some basic smart home integration. I am considering the Flex 50. In response to some comments I have seen here I have the following responses.

 

The Konnected board effectively replaces the Honeywell panel and directly talks to the sensors so it does apparently work here in the UK. However it only works with wired sensors.

 

I am under the impression that the Honeywell Galaxy Flex shares zones between wireless and wired sensors so a Flex 50 cannot do 50 wired sensors and additional wireless sensors. It can do 52 wired or 40 wireless not therefore a total of 92. Presumably the same applies for the Flex 20 which I agree is too small.

 

The Envisalink does not officially support the Honeywell Galaxy only the Vista. Yes the Vista and Galaxy are different, as has been mentioned the use of balanced circuits is one example. However I am not convinced that alone would be sufficient to make using the Envisalink impossible to use so perhaps there are some other differences as well.

 

The DSC PowerSeries can be obtained still in the UK but not via your average alarm supplier. It is the only UK available product officially supported by Envisalink and AlarmDecoder. The DSC Neo is not supported by the Envisalink or AlarmDecoder.

 

I have seen mention on this very site of people managing to use a Honeywell Ethernet module with a Galaxy Panel and software to then make it available via MQTT. Using MQTT one could then link to various smart home systems. I have seen similar mention on the Home Assistant forum although zero details were provided. See https://community.home-assistant.io/t/uk-alarms-for-ha-recomentations/37932/34

 

See the following as possible starting points for possibly doing this ones self.

 

https://github.com/dklemm/FlexSIA2MQTT

 

As apparently the Honeywell Galaxy uses an RS485 serial bus and SIA signalling this should in theory be similar enough to other panels to exploit. However using the Honeywell Ethernet interface also should in theory be possible as after all the official Galaxy GX Remote Control App communicates and controls the alarm panel this way. So for that matter does Honeywell's WIN-PAK software.

 

Going back to the differences between a Honeywell Vista and a Honeywell Galaxy. Again I wonder if this is as substantial as people are making out. After all the Honeywell Vista 6280 touchscreen is mostly similar to the Honeywell Galaxy Touch Centre Plus.

 

https://www.security.honeywell.com/product-repository/6280w-6280s

https://www.security.honeywell.com/uk/product-repository/galaxy-touchcenter-plus

 

Yes the bezels are different, yes the 6280 has Z-Wave support but other than that the user interface, screen and LEDs are the same.

 

It should be noted that the user interface of the GX Remote Control app is more like that of the Honeywell Vista 6290 touch screen. I hope that the Touch Centre Plus is therefore replaced by an equivalent of the 6290.

 

https://www.security.honeywellhome.com/product-repository/6290w

 

[james.wilson]

the galaxy and vista are 2 completly different products. The galaxy was deveopled in scotland long before ademco purchased microtech and long before honeywell purchased ademco. The vista was developed in the US

15 minutes ago, jelockwood said:

The Konnected board effectively replaces the Honeywell panel and directly talks to the sensors so it does apparently work here in the UK. However it only works with wired sensors.

 

it doesnt. It connects to the same inputs but wont work on a galaxy. You could use this board from the galaxy using links (menu option) relays and outputs. But not directly to the eol wiring. If using this board via links you could use the rf detectors too, but im fairly sure the rf does not do status in the unset state.

Galaxy guy (member) is developing something for this but id look at what you actually need re status, circuit activity, remote control etc from the HA system. 

[GalaxyGuy]

Go for a Flex FX100+ as it supports lots of links and zones for automation. Here's the latest SelfMon virtual device module in action with MQTT. The project has been slightly delayed, as I've been assigned to work on covid for a few weeks.

 

 

 

[GalaxyGuy]

23 hours ago, jelockwood said:

 

 

See the following as possible starting points for possibly doing this ones self.

 

https://github.com/dklemm/FlexSIA2MQTT

 

 

jelockwood, have you tried this and managed to get it to run? I tried with npm and docker on my mac, but although it seemed to build, the image would just exit with no messages. I have an FX100+ sitting testing on the bench to test the software out. I've not used typescript at all so I may be missing something. These new abstracted languages seem really convoluted sometimes. Just a bunch of yaml files with abstract commands. Great when they work, but not so great when there's an issue.  I don't think the author ever responded to previous questions, but his repo build instruction is definitely missing some parts.

 

[jelockwood]

@Galaxy Guy

I have not tried those links yet myself as I have not yet bought a panel.

If you are writing your own solution I totally appreciate it has to be on your timescale and express my appreciation for your efforts. Will your solution eventually allow adding virtual zones received via MQTT? I would like to use non-Honeywell smoke and flood sensors but link them to the Honeywell.

 

PS. I dislike npm as well.

[GalaxyGuy]

4 minutes ago, jelockwood said:

@Galaxy Guy

I have not tried those links yet myself as I have not yet bought a panel.

If you are writing your own solution I totally appreciate it has to be on your timescale and express my appreciation for your efforts. Will your solution eventually allow adding virtual zones received via MQTT? I would like to use non-Honeywell smoke and flood sensors but link them to the Honeywell.

 

PS. I dislike npm as well.

 

The development is a SelfMon product and will eventually support an MQTT based receiver at the SelfMon side and transmit panel SIA events via MQTT.  As you can see from the image above, the virtual RIO devices have 8 inputs and 4 outputs and I've enabled 4 virtual module addresses on the test panel. The outputs are driven by the panel and can be forwarded links of zone status or just standard outputs like bells, set, etc.  The panel sees the module as if it were a hardware RIO. When the output is set by the panel, the module forwards the status change to the MQTT server (broker) and it can be picked up by any subscribing client.  The virtual RIO also subscribes to its own 8 input channels, so if you have another device that publishes a status change to one of the input channels, then that input change is sent to the control panel. The intention is that an automation controller will act as a middle-man in this process. That is, unless the other sensors have the capability to publish to specific MQTT topics directly.

 

The reason for requiring the bigger panels is to maximise the number of virtual RIO's that can be enabled alongside wired RIO's.  The FX100+ can take 11 external RIO's, so you can have the on-board, a couple of hard wired RIO's and then use the remainder of the addresses to maximise the number of virtualised outputs and inputs available.

 

This is a block diagram of the device:

http://www.selfmon.uk/manuals/LCE-K3/LCE-K3-MANUAL.pdf 

 

 

[jelockwood]

@Galaxy Guy

I am not ready yet to take the plunge. But in the meantime if I may I will ask a few more questions.

 

I got the impression that an alarm panel could support a number of wired and/or wireless sensors using the built-in board without needing a RIO and that a RIO was purely a way of expanding the capacity. Are you saying RIOs are compulsory? It makes it more expensive than I thought but not necessarily a blocker. Do the RIOs fit inside the panel box?

 

Your Selfmon solution. I was intending to use the GX Remote app for self monitoring and looking at an integration solution both to add some non-Honeywell sensors e.g. smoke and leak and yes this approach would also mean it should be possible to use a smart home platform also to monitor the alarm system. Does your solution require giving access to your web server? Whilst I can see this does offer alert services etc. it means another avenue of Internet traffic that hypothetically could be attacked. I would also be wanting the MQTT aspect to operate purely internally on my network both again for security and to avoid issues due to any Internet connectivity issues.

 

If I don't want or need alerts from your service and purely want the MQTT option and any hardware does this still require an ongoing subscription? (The equivalent competing products for the Honeywell Vista i.e. AlarmDecoder and Envisalink would not require subscriptions.

[MrHappy]

27 minutes ago, jelockwood said:

@Galaxy Guy

I am not ready yet to take the plunge. But in the meantime if I may I will ask a few more questions.

 

I got the impression that an alarm panel could support a number of wired and/or wireless sensors using the built-in board without needing a RIO and that a RIO was purely a way of expanding the capacity. Are you saying RIOs are compulsory? It makes it more expensive than I thought but not necessarily a blocker. Do the RIOs fit inside the panel box?

 

Your Selfmon solution. I was intending to use the GX Remote app for self monitoring and looking at an integration solution both to add some non-Honeywell sensors e.g. smoke and leak and yes this approach would also mean it should be possible to use a smart home platform also to monitor the alarm system. Does your solution require giving access to your web server? Whilst I can see this does offer alert services etc. it means another avenue of Internet traffic that hypothetically could be attacked. I would also be wanting the MQTT aspect to operate purely internally on my network both again for security and to avoid issues due to any Internet connectivity issues.

 

If I don't want or need alerts from your service and purely want the MQTT option and any hardware does this still require an ongoing subscription? (The equivalent competing products for the Honeywell Vista i.e. AlarmDecoder and Envisalink would not require subscriptions.

 

buy some kit, place it on the bench

 

play with it,

 

learn what it does & doesn't do

 

it the project is gonna not  work or come into too dear, pop it al back the boxes & you'll get most of your £ on ebay 

[james.wilson]

I would expect anyone doing anything will result in some sort of cost, either from buying product or buying a service. I'm really interested in the galaxy mqtt service myself

[al-yeti]

3 hours ago, jelockwood said:

@Galaxy Guy

I am not ready yet to take the plunge. But in the meantime if I may I will ask a few more questions.

 

I got the impression that an alarm panel could support a number of wired and/or wireless sensors using the built-in board without needing a RIO and that a RIO was purely a way of expanding the capacity. Are you saying RIOs are compulsory? It makes it more expensive than I thought but not necessarily a blocker. Do the RIOs fit inside the panel box?

 

Your Selfmon solution. I was intending to use the GX Remote app for self monitoring and looking at an integration solution both to add some non-Honeywell sensors e.g. smoke and leak and yes this approach would also mean it should be possible to use a smart home platform also to monitor the alarm system. Does your solution require giving access to your web server? Whilst I can see this does offer alert services etc. it means another avenue of Internet traffic that hypothetically could be attacked. I would also be wanting the MQTT aspect to operate purely internally on my network both again for security and to avoid issues due to any Internet connectivity issues.

 

If I don't want or need alerts from your service and purely want the MQTT option and any hardware does this still require an ongoing subscription? (The equivalent competing products for the Honeywell Vista i.e. AlarmDecoder and Envisalink would not require subscriptions.

So you want something for free? Perhaps £2000-£3000 then will get you lifetime mqtt service......