Discussing current smart(ish) alarm systems

[jelockwood]

Whilst it is somewhat to be expected with the US being the source of much new technology that the US therefore would get access to newer/smarter products - specifically in this case security products before the UK/EU the sad reality is that even taking this in to account the UK/EU market is or has been woeful in comparison. This even applies when supposedly the same brand operates in both the US and the UK/EU e.g. Honeywell/Resideo and ADT.

 

To some extent this difference is down to the UK insurance, security and alarm makers focussing totally on security and I am willing to accept being as a result better in this aspect than US products but they have in the UK not just treated features and easy of use as secondary but it seems have completely and utterly ignored this.

 

As a result whilst touch screen panels are common in the US they are rare as hens teeth on UK systems, similarly integration with smart home systems is also far less common. Even newer so called smart alarm systems such as Verisure, Simplisafe, Boundary and Abode are in comparison relatively unfriendly and primitive systems compared to US offerings.

 

(The fact that Verisure supports Arlo smart doorbells and cameras is not down to Verisure being suddenly open minded and collaborative and accepting the use of other brands of smart home products but is down to their buying the rights in Europe to the Arlo product range and hence even though it is the exact same product as before when it was treated by Verisure as a dangerous alien creature it is now treated as their best of friends.)

 

I am aware that ADT US and ADT UK are in reality totally different companies and have in general totally different products although they do not make this obvious. I was therefore aware the ADT US had smart(er) offerings than ADT UK. However more recently I see that ADT UK have a new offering with a touch screen controller and do list support for some smart home products including Philips Hue, Nest Smart Thermostat, Danalock and what I can tell is a rebadged SkyBell Trim Plus smart doorbell. I can also tell that this ADT touch screen is actually a rebadged Quolsys IQ Panel 4. (Even though the ADT UK website incorrectly lists it as an IQ2.)

 

This is therefore an interesting development. ADT UK are a well established brand with an installation and monitoring service. The Quolsys product range is also - at least in the US a well known brand with a lot of options and reasonable options for smart home integration.

 

https://www.adt.co.uk/adt-smart-home-hub

 

The ADT UK page does say it supports Zigbee and Zwave and as mentioned some well known smart home products. Knowing as I do that this is a rebadged Quolsys panel this suggests additional smart home possibilities maybe possible. However the ADT UK page is woefully lacking in details and the Quolsys UK page is not much better. Neither therefore make it clear which Zwave frequency the UK product uses. The list of Quolsys accessories on the UK site is also much smaller than the US site. This is not clear if this is down to technical issues although as Quolsys' own accessories would be presumed to use Quolsys' own 2G wireless technology and not Zwave or Zigbee I do not see why this should be so.

 

Of a more particular interest one aspect of so called smart alarm systems is that they typically have only battery powered sensors and sirens. Whilst it is practical to swap batteries on indoor sensors as they can be easily reached, swapping the batteries on an external siren which is normally located high up a wall is definitely not, and of course if the battery dies no-one can hear it. (Even a Solar panel does not help as it is powering a battery which will eventually die.)

 

Now, since I know that the ADT UK system is a rebadged Quolsys system, I also know that Quolsys have the option of a hybrid system with an accessory that allows connecting wired sensors and a wired siren! This accessory is not listed on the Quolsys UK page.  I consider it a complete waste of time asking ADT UK.  

 

Is anyone here at all familiar with ADT UK and Quolsys and able to comment at all?

 

I want to see if this https://qolsys.com/iq-hardwire-16/ can be used with the ADT UK/Quolsys UK version and if it can be obtained in the UK. It would also be helpful to have confirmation that 'standard' UK wired sensors would be compatible with it.

 

Note: Quolsys in the US use Alarm.com for monitoring and indeed if you don't sign up for this the panel cannot even be self remotely monitored as the mobile phone app requires an Alarm.com account. I would guess either ADT UK are providing their own compatible service or more likely reselling the Alarm.com service.

 

Note: Touch screens make configuration easier and look nicer, they can include a camera to take pictures of whoever is turning on/off the alarm and can show video from cameras and smart doorbells. What they could do and is often shown in fictional Films or TV shows is a plan view of a building and highlighting on the 'map' the location of which sensor has triggered the alarm. Sadly none appear to do this in real life (yet) although this has been achieved by tech enthusiasts using Home Assistant.

Edited January 13, 2023 by jelockwood

[sixwheeledbeast]

A DIY'er is unlikely to care for running wires and an installer needs systems to conform to BS/EN, they are completely separate markets.

ADT will not be interested in helping a DIY project, they make money from contract systems.

If it's DIY and your insurance don't care you can do what you want (within reason) but don't expect it to work correctly or provide any usable evidence if it was required.

Touch screen are pointless and expensive when pulled off the wall and stamped on, an installer being called to that after a break in wouldn't have a spare, leaving you without a system after a break in...

 

[PeterJames]

The uk and the eu security industry is far more secure than the us. There are touch screen keypads out there, but I would agree that many of the uk rkp's are not that aesthetically pleasing but Ive yet to see a rkp that is fantastic.

 

Personally if you dont like the look of the rkp then put it in a cupboard, if you are having the system installed by a professional they will have alternative methods of arming and disarming your system you need the keypad from a programming point of view, but thats it nowadays you can use your smartphone, or a proximity reader and fob, or a wireless device, or even locking unlocking your door to arm/disarm the alarm.

 

  

[james.wilson]

most 'smart' systems are easily disabled.

a pro company is not likely or permitted to use a non compliant product that would expose them to a failure to perform claim from yourself or your insurer.

approved systems are secure and compliant, allowing 3rd control from unapproved and it most cases insecure systems isn't something I would do or recommend anyone do even DIY.

people would use a lock made of plastic but seem not to care about the security of their electronic protection, this can be seen by the horrible stuff we all see out there.

im a big supporter of home automation but most people want it free so there is little business case to make product fir that market 

this will change imo

 

[al-yeti]

6 hours ago, jelockwood said:

Whilst it is somewhat to be expected with the US being the source of much new technology that the US therefore would get access to newer/smarter products - specifically in this case security products before the UK/EU the sad reality is that even taking this in to account the UK/EU market is or has been woeful in comparison. This even applies when supposedly the same brand operates in both the US and the UK/EU e.g. Honeywell/Resideo and ADT.

 

To some extent this difference is down to the UK insurance, security and alarm makers focussing totally on security and I am willing to accept being as a result better in this aspect than US products but they have in the UK not just treated features and easy of use as secondary but it seems have completely and utterly ignored this.

 

As a result whilst touch screen panels are common in the US they are rare as hens teeth on UK systems, similarly integration with smart home systems is also far less common. Even newer so called smart alarm systems such as Verisure, Simplisafe, Boundary and Abode are in comparison relatively unfriendly and primitive systems compared to US offerings.

 

(The fact that Verisure supports Arlo smart doorbells and cameras is not down to Verisure being suddenly open minded and collaborative and accepting the use of other brands of smart home products but is down to their buying the rights in Europe to the Arlo product range and hence even though it is the exact same product as before when it was treated by Verisure as a dangerous alien creature it is now treated as their best of friends.)

 

I am aware that ADT US and ADT UK are in reality totally different companies and have in general totally different products although they do not make this obvious. I was therefore aware the ADT US had smart(er) offerings than ADT UK. However more recently I see that ADT UK have a new offering with a touch screen controller and do list support for some smart home products including Philips Hue, Nest Smart Thermostat, Danalock and what I can tell is a rebadged SkyBell Trim Plus smart doorbell. I can also tell that this ADT touch screen is actually a rebadged Quolsys IQ Panel 4. (Even though the ADT UK website incorrectly lists it as an IQ2.)

 

This is therefore an interesting development. ADT UK are a well established brand with an installation and monitoring service. The Quolsys product range is also - at least in the US a well known brand with a lot of options and reasonable options for smart home integration.

 

https://www.adt.co.uk/adt-smart-home-hub

 

The ADT UK page does say it supports Zigbee and Zwave and as mentioned some well known smart home products. Knowing as I do that this is a rebadged Quolsys panel this suggests additional smart home possibilities maybe possible. However the ADT UK page is woefully lacking in details and the Quolsys UK page is not much better. Neither therefore make it clear which Zwave frequency the UK product uses. The list of Quolsys accessories on the UK site is also much smaller than the US site. This is not clear if this is down to technical issues although as Quolsys' own accessories would be presumed to use Quolsys' own 2G wireless technology and not Zwave or Zigbee I do not see why this should be so.

 

Of a more particular interest one aspect of so called smart alarm systems is that they typically have only battery powered sensors and sirens. Whilst it is practical to swap batteries on indoor sensors as they can be easily reached, swapping the batteries on an external siren which is normally located high up a wall is definitely not, and of course if the battery dies no-one can hear it. (Even a Solar panel does not help as it is powering a battery which will eventually die.)

 

Now, since I know that the ADT UK system is a rebadged Quolsys system, I also know that Quolsys have the option of a hybrid system with an accessory that allows connecting wired sensors and a wired siren! This accessory is not listed on the Quolsys UK page.  I consider it a complete waste of time asking ADT UK.  

 

Is anyone here at all familiar with ADT UK and Quolsys and able to comment at all?

 

I want to see if this https://qolsys.com/iq-hardwire-16/ can be used with the ADT UK/Quolsys UK version and if it can be obtained in the UK. It would also be helpful to have confirmation that 'standard' UK wired sensors would be compatible with it.

 

Note: Quolsys in the US use Alarm.com for monitoring and indeed if you don't sign up for this the panel cannot even be self remotely monitored as the mobile phone app requires an Alarm.com account. I would guess either ADT UK are providing their own compatible service or more likely reselling the Alarm.com service.

 

Note: Touch screens make configuration easier and look nicer, they can include a camera to take pictures of whoever is turning on/off the alarm and can show video from cameras and smart doorbells. What they could do and is often shown in fictional Films or TV shows is a plan view of a building and highlighting on the 'map' the location of which sensor has triggered the alarm. Sadly none appear to do this in real life (yet) although this has been achieved by tech enthusiasts using Home Assistant.

Basically you want to DIY it 

 

Buy stuff from UK, then from us and hope it works together instead of going with adt and signing up

 

If you meant something else in all of the long story , that's all I could figure from it.....

[james.wilson]

Nothing wrong with adt at all. However people spend more on coffee beer or fags than they do their security 

Perhaps we should swap, whatever someone does for what we do. 

Or we could strike maybe Noone will notice that either