Miko Posted April 3, 2007 Posted April 3, 2007 We prefare in my country - Czech Republic not to give eng. manuals to end user. Its simple... most of us are very curious people or detailman. Give them eng. manual and you could wait for calls why this or that function is not set etc. (Of course there is difference between 10y old and new panel or small DSC and Galaxy G3)
kensplace Posted April 18, 2007 Posted April 18, 2007 As far as the argument about manuals and people being able to disable an alarm in 30 seconds goes, I dont think thats really a valid argument. Ok, alarm systems (at least the older ones I have seen) are easy peasy to disarm, quickly, BUT if you installers did your job correctly - ie Made sure no kit was installed that had a non-changeable overall master code. Made sure no default codes were ever used. Made sure the main panel was inaccessible - so it would take a lot longer than 30 seconds just to find the thing, then even longer to get at it (ie securely locked, and hidden) then I fail to see how anyone would be able to disable the alarm quickly, even with the manual. If its a inside job, then they can have all the time in the world to do it, including research, to buy their own alarm to practice on, or even just buy a manual of the net. Or - they could use an ounce of common sense and silence or default the system even without a manual with a little electronics knowledge. But your average burgler is thicker than a plank of wood, and probably could not even understand a manual, even if they had one. Most are just opportunistic, with no forward planning. If a pro wanted to learn how to disable a certain type of alarm in 30 seconds, then they will - and at the end of the day, its the industries fault for actually supplying and INSTALLING **** like that in the first place. Instead of hiding that info - professionals should put pressure on the manufacturers to get their act together. Next, safety - a disclaimer could be included, and a links to electrical safety pages etc. Warnings could be made that incorrect programming could leave the system wide open, non-operational etc. Whats worse, someone having a go inside a panel with a manual, or someone having a go inside a panel without a manual? Next - copyright - obviously you should respect copyright, if a manu does not want the manuals shown, dont show em. If a manu does not mind - then there is no problem... Course, people sell the manuals on the net all the time, never seen any action taken against them yet........ And they do it for a living!
badge Posted April 26, 2007 Posted April 26, 2007 Hi New to this forum and it looks excellent - I like the professional attitude. I have an Accenta 8 installed and all I want to do is change the entry code because it may have been compromised. I have the Engineering Information but not a 'Users Manual'. Are they perhaps the same thing? Is User Code 1 the code that I use for entry/exit ? Do I need to enter the engineer code before I can change the user entry code? I wont post the instructions shown for obvious reasons but are they only ones available? If anyone can help I would be grateful Badge
FASTCAR Posted April 26, 2007 Posted April 26, 2007 Assuming you have a working user code , try this.. ACCENTA6_8_User.pdf
logical Posted April 26, 2007 Posted April 26, 2007 As far as the argument about manuals and people being able to disable an alarm in 30 seconds goes, I dont think thats really a valid argument.Ok, alarm systems (at least the older ones I have seen) are easy peasy to disarm, quickly, BUT if you installers did your job correctly - ie Made sure no kit was installed that had a non-changeable overall master code. Made sure no default codes were ever used. Made sure the main panel was inaccessible - so it would take a lot longer than 30 seconds just to find the thing, then even longer to get at it (ie securely locked, and hidden) then I fail to see how anyone would be able to disable the alarm quickly, even with the manual. If its a inside job, then they can have all the time in the world to do it, including research, to buy their own alarm to practice on, or even just buy a manual of the net. Or - they could use an ounce of common sense and silence or default the system even without a manual with a little electronics knowledge. But your average burgler is thicker than a plank of wood, and probably could not even understand a manual, even if they had one. Most are just opportunistic, with no forward planning. If a pro wanted to learn how to disable a certain type of alarm in 30 seconds, then they will - and at the end of the day, its the industries fault for actually supplying and INSTALLING **** like that in the first place. Instead of hiding that info - professionals should put pressure on the manufacturers to get their act together. Next, safety - a disclaimer could be included, and a links to electrical safety pages etc. Warnings could be made that incorrect programming could leave the system wide open, non-operational etc. Whats worse, someone having a go inside a panel with a manual, or someone having a go inside a panel without a manual? Next - copyright - obviously you should respect copyright, if a manu does not want the manuals shown, dont show em. If a manu does not mind - then there is no problem... Course, people sell the manuals on the net all the time, never seen any action taken against them yet........ And they do it for a living! intresting 1)- what if customer wants default code leaving in panel (some do , even when warned against it) 2)-im not aware of any current panel that has a "non-changeable overall master code" (please correct someone if im wrong and i`m aware of old 2nd hand panels where master code programming is an engineer function but i cant really see any reputable installer supplying one of these) 3)-its the customers house and they decide where the endstation is to be placed.we can only advise but i think you`ll also find that reputable (that word again!!) installers would protect a vulnerable panel position with some form of detection for that area professionals are in the alarm business to make a living. if you would like to fund the professional to put pressure on manufacturers (i.e. pay them for it) i`m sure there would be people willing to pursue manufacturers , not sure what for exactly though putting a disclaimer on any advice isnt enough to stop a dead persons relatives taking you to the cleaners where the death has been caused by the advisors actions. i dont want to get sued and never give any "electrical" advice to anyone , not even people who claim to be sparks However!!!! i do agree 100% (IVE FOUND SOMETHING TO AGREE ON!!!) about copyright Trade Member
logical Posted April 26, 2007 Posted April 26, 2007 i cant edit that now, but i meant someone please correct ME on point one , not just correct someone (doh!!) kensplace- i also think you would feel differently if someone used info supplied to disable your alarm. i also feel the point about "old alarms" being easier to disable is irrelevant, i dont want to supply info that could lead to anyone suffering a loss , its just not right to do so oh by the way , its not just about disabling the panels there are other ways (dont ask im not telling) to render a system useless without defaulting it Trade Member
SecureAbility Posted April 28, 2007 Posted April 28, 2007 I agree 100% with you alarmgard. I agree with AlarmGard and Karl 100%, a customer with an engineer manual is a head ache waiting to happen! Its a funny old game........
amateurandy Posted May 2, 2007 Posted May 2, 2007 I'd be interested to learn why everyone else can do it, but if it's done here I get threated with legal action.. An example I've just found by accident is *******. They sell alarms and the engineering manuals are on their web site. Post edited as although not a direct link to engineering manuals, it did provide an easy route to them.
jplx Posted May 18, 2007 Posted May 18, 2007 Any one know where to get hold of Galaxy 16+ Engineer's Manual? Thanks
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