Guest dale Posted October 14, 2003 Posted October 14, 2003 I think weve exhausted this one... lets agree to disagree as otherwise we will just each others corners till the cows come home. Dale
morph Posted October 15, 2003 Posted October 15, 2003 Good move on the manual front. Peters right in saying that most companies standardise on one panel/ type of equipment. If we do take over an obscure panel or attend a fault, a quick call to the office or another engineer would normally help. To help the small installers on the site what about having a full list of manufacturers technical helplines in the protected area. But just as a point of interest on the Health and Safety Front, we shouldn't be puting any paperwork inside the panel, as it is a fire risk. Even if its in a self adhesive wallet. The wallet/paperwork could slip/detach and cause a fire. If my memory serves me correctly both Nacoss and the BSIA issued a warning against this practice and the prefered method was to fit a a lockable box adjacent to the panel or buy one of ACT's plastic document boxes. And as to obtaining the password for the protected areas who do we go about this. Colin.
An Engineer Posted October 15, 2003 Posted October 15, 2003 I don't know how I feel on the subject after reading all the different views above. It has always been my beleif that the engineer manual should be kept by the engineer and user manual given to the user. After all, thats why they are two different manuals. I don't think that anyone could be held accountable for an end user injuring himself by fiddling with the alarm because there are all types of mains sockets, switches and even consumer units available to the public at B&Q which do pose more of a hazard. I totally agree with the car manual mentioned above. I think that Ademco have took this view too because only the user manual is supplied with the Galaxy panel when bought. Therefore, the user has no right to this because it was never supplied with the equipment. Maybe in the future alarm systems will give the user more control over the alarm system. Without going too far into the programming they may be able to change certain aspects of its operation to suit changing circumstances. The keypad could act as a user friendly interface between customer and alarms panel guiding them through different set ups and even informing why something can not be done. Service Engineer My opinions may not reflect those of my employer, managers, colleagues, customers, friends, family or pet rabbit.
Guest Affinity Posted October 15, 2003 Posted October 15, 2003 would you guys like our opinion on this as manufactureres if I ask in the morning???I can try and find out the legal implecations too. Do you remember me being asked by Dinefwr about doing a CQR Forum on the CQR site??????? It was due to legal implecations that I could not go ahead with it. As manufacturers we cant risk having installers or engineers giving out information on a site under our name and it being seen as our reply or advice incase it is incorrect or the questioner injures himself due to a response from the site. It is deemed ok to be on an unafilliated site such as this where Steve has openly stated at the beginning that the site takes no responsibility for advice given or taken. Speaking on my own behalf I thought qualified electricians were legally responsible for equipment if they saw it was unsafe and took no action ....... if that is the case and I stand corrected if wrong (its just that I know my other half is in his job), is it wise to give out engineering manuals to the public? Anway as I said I will check where we as manufacturers stand on this.
Guest Peter James Posted October 15, 2003 Posted October 15, 2003 Colin You were correct about the Nacoss warning reference the paperwork in panels, and all of our engineers are aware that it could be a fire risk and keep the paperwork away from the hot bits. (common sense really) Although there never has been (and Nacoss will back this statement up) any reported incidences of fires or smoke damage etc caused by paperwork left in panels. Pete
Service Engineer Posted October 15, 2003 Author Posted October 15, 2003 Yes Linda please enquire as to you companies position regarding any Engineer information and legalities please. I already know another major manufacturers stance on this subject, lets see if yours is simillar ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer)
morph Posted October 16, 2003 Posted October 16, 2003 HI Linda, CQR's opinion would be helpful along with any other manufacturers out there who may be observing and not contributing!! It is an issue that has various implications to the installer. Colin.
paul fae kings Posted October 16, 2003 Posted October 16, 2003 dont know if im right or wrong on this,but inever have & probably never will leave an engineers manual with a customer. Just my personal opinion though.
mr silcox Posted October 17, 2003 Posted October 17, 2003 watching the manual requests over the last 6 months they tend to be manly asking for "job on the side panels" like ade ,a1 etc most of these had insaller insruction and user in the same book i can't see a problem with these they don't want to pay for a skilled alarm eng. and to be honest do you really want these as customers ???? but as for eng. it sometimes hard to get a manual for something old (and most company only keep the most up to date stuff) i would be handy to know which of us are or run alarm eng. compans (without giving to much away ) perhaps dave could sort something like this??
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