Tallbloke Posted November 29, 2005 Posted November 29, 2005 I'm in the middle of a reinstatement of a 10 zone domestic system that has had some new cabling installed due to building work. 4 detectors were missing and I've replaced these but the problem I'm getting is the 'Relearn Required' displayed when leaving engineering. I tried going into eng. 1, pressing A which, I think, shows which biccies the panel can see. I then pressed C to save. I still have missing detectors. Do I buzz the cables (the owner is a fridge and AC engineer and installed and tested the cables himself) or am I missing something else? I checked the biscuit wiring, BTW. I've asked Richl for access to the manuals but I need to go back tomorrow and finish and I may not get access in time. I've worked on Menvier panels before without a problem but this one has me stumped. , Paul.
Guest rjbsec Posted November 29, 2005 Posted November 29, 2005 I'm in the middle of a reinstatement of a 10 zone domestic system that has had some new cabling installed due to building work. 4 detectors were missing and I've replaced these but the problem I'm getting is the 'Relearn Required' displayed when leaving engineering. I tried going into eng. 1, pressing A which, I think, shows which biccies the panel can see. I then pressed C to save. I still have missing detectors. Do I buzz the cables (the owner is a fridge and AC engineer and installed and tested the cables himself) or am I missing something else? I checked the biscuit wiring, BTW. I've asked Richl for access to the manuals but I need to go back tomorrow and finish and I may not get access in time. I've worked on Menvier panels before without a problem but this one has me stumped., Paul. "Relearn Required" requires pressing [C] from Engineer Menu 1 - quick "chime" then [Esc] to leave engineering mode. Missing biscuits will generally indicate a lack of continuity in either + or - leg, typically a tamper fault on the first detector which cuts off response from it and all following detectors on the cable run. There are other issues with iD biscuits but the above would be first to try.
Guest Posted November 29, 2005 Posted November 29, 2005 relearn required is for hardware eg rkp's moden ect... NOT the Id line eng menu 01 press c then o then esc should say "site open" then give banner text if programed
Guest rjbsec Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 relearn required is for hardware eg rkp's moden ect... NOT the Id line eng menu 01 press c then o then esc should say "site open" then give banner text if programed Actually from engineer menu 1 pressing [C] will do the relearn and then pressing [Esc] will return to the display [Engineer on site]. To remove the [Engineer on site] display requires user code then [Esc], (or set then unset), which will return to the normal Day display - [0] has no application here!
secboy Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 Actually from engineer menu 1 pressing [C] will do the relearn and then pressing [Esc] will return to the display [Engineer on site].To remove the [Engineer on site] display requires user code then [Esc], (or set then unset), which will return to the normal Day display - [0] has no application here! I,m a bit rusty on this but I thought the "o" put the panel to customer menu so that esc put the panel directly into day mode instead of eng on site this meant that you did not have to ask for the user code or ask the customer to enter their code to clear back to day ?. Paul.
Guest rjbsec Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 I,m a bit rusty on this but I thought the "o" put the panel to customer menu so that esc put the panel directly into day mode instead of eng on site this meant that you did not have to ask for the user code or ask the customer to enter their code to clear back to day ?. Paul. Yes you are absolutely right, I was thinking "in the box", which is not always a good idea - apologies to Mr Happy.
Tallbloke Posted November 30, 2005 Author Posted November 30, 2005 Thanks for the input, guys. Some aspects to have a go at there. The tamper fault that takes offline everything downstream of it is interesting, although the detectors that are missing are cabled back to the panel. I might try connecting the id lines one at a time so I can isolate the fault (s). When I can get in, that is - they left the wrong key hidden today so I'm going back tomorrow. I've registered with Menvier so that I could download the manual. Regards, Paul.
Guest rjbsec Posted November 30, 2005 Posted November 30, 2005 the detectors that are missing are cabled back to the panel. If you mean separate cable for each detector then the issue of a tamper causing problems "down the line" would obviously not apply. Don't know which biscuits you are using for the new detectors, I personally haven't tried the iDPlus biscuits on the old iD panels as I was led to believe that they were not compatible, but if the other biscuits on the system are the old iD I would be using old iD for the new detectors. iDPlus compatible panels normally have a sticker on the pcb saying they are compatible with both types of biscuit.
Tallbloke Posted November 30, 2005 Author Posted November 30, 2005 Ah, the biscuits I used are the new type- the ones that you can read the number on! One of them - five - came online ok, which suggests that the iDplus biscuits ARE compatible. The original detectors that are wired in daisy chain are all working ok bar one, which may be a faulty biscuit - he's had some replaced over the years. Luckily, the bloke is ok and says he will pay for the extra time due to the faults. Naturally, I want to get it sorted ASAP. I think I may replace ALL ten biscuits as there may be issues with mixing old and new. Thanks again for your interest. Paul.
Tallbloke Posted December 1, 2005 Author Posted December 1, 2005 Right. Swapped the old biscuits for new and all but two of the zones came up so I reckoned mixing biscuits was to blame. There was er, a 'polarity issue' with the two missing biccies so I went out and got more. When I got back, I replaced the two faulty biscuits and found that the panel now had no zones. Nothing I did - even replacing the old biscuits - made any difference,. I spoke to a chap at Menvier who told me the new biscuits are NOT compatible with the old panel and couldn't understand why they appeared to work, even for a short time. He told me a new PCB would be needed so tomorrow I'm replacing the PCB. Had I known that it was going to be so much trouble, I'd have replaced the panel with something conventional right from the off.
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